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What will make attendance better?
- Thread starter BUBraves2006
- Start date
BradleyBiz
New member
Renaissance can probably add some seating. A capacity of 6,000? Highly unlikely. 5,000 is probably more practical. Anything else would have to be cost prohibitive. But seating is not the only thing Renaissance will have to overcome. Security and admission would be a disaster for a crowd of 4-5k. Concessions would be a mess unless they are able to add 4-5 new areas. Plus you probably lose some of the variety of concessions. If the move is made and these areas are not addressed adequately, you will be looking at a Belmont situation where you have a 4500 seat gym that’s half filled. That is a major risk of going down this path.
RC is a glorified high school gym. Looks nice but has some major drawbacks. Unfortunately, Bradley was very shortsighted when RC was designed. If it was designed for 6000-7000, we’d already be there.
RC is a glorified high school gym. Looks nice but has some major drawbacks. Unfortunately, Bradley was very shortsighted when RC was designed. If it was designed for 6000-7000, we’d already be there.
BUBraves2006
New member
Many great responses on the thread - glad I started it ... a couple more thoughts I've had when reading through ->
- Some may say, well, let's focus on the locals. That's fine but unless those locals are going to be loud, it doesn't really make the environment more exciting. And, I'm actually not saying this to blame the locals. I'm going back to the students and maybe even the band and cheerleaders as well. When I was attending, the place was LOUD. And this was driven by a combination of a thundering band, very loud chants by the students most possessions and cheerleaders always starting some kind of chant to get the students and the crowd into it. Maybe I'm being too nostalgic at times but, I'm certain that was part of the reason why people went to so many games. It was EXCITING! (Among many of the other reasons already stated)
I worked on the construction of renaissance....was told at the time there is room on the east court side (across from benches) was built with room for upper deck expansion ....
Yes. Joanne Glasser commissioned a study a decade ago when Bradley was having problems negotiating a new contract with the Civic Center, and she felt she needed a backup plan to help give her an advantage in negotiating. It found that it was feasible to add balconies on one or both sides that would increase the capacity to a maximum of a little over 6,000. The structure could possibly be expanded on either side.
And it could be modified to provide easy admission, concessions, restrooms, security, etc. Parking would be the only serious issue. However, Bradley owns most of the properties to the west and south, as well as in other areas that could be redesigned for parking. It could be done, and I believe eventually it will be. It's been done at many smaller private schools, such as Drake (capacity 6,400) and Belmont (capacity 5,000). Each of those 2 arenas have only one concession area in their entrance lobbies, and it works fine.
mfogelmark
New member
My family has held season tickets since the 70's. I personally have been going to games since 1981. The level of excitement at the Fieldhouse has never been duplicated at PCC. I understand the move to a bigger arena and at the time the team was exciting and attendance was fantastic. Let's face it, we had a lot of really down years that drove alot of fans away.
To me, the keys to driving attendance back up are trying to create new, younger BU fans. When you look at the crowd at most home games, I would guess that the average fan is late 40's and up. As the years go on, you'll lose more and more of those fans. Bradley has to start attracting younger, next generation fans now. The lack of a student section is another huge detractor. I remember the glory days when the student section was packed. Who remembers the students making fun of Nolan Richardson and his polka dot jackets? They brought energy and they brought excitement. Bradley should be doing everything they can (free tickets, free transportation, deals with downtown businesses) to get students to PCC for games. If they aren't going to do that, move the games back on campus and accept the fact that you'll have smaller crowds that sound louder than what we have now but also accept that you're never going to draw good competition to Peoria for home games.
To me, the keys to driving attendance back up are trying to create new, younger BU fans. When you look at the crowd at most home games, I would guess that the average fan is late 40's and up. As the years go on, you'll lose more and more of those fans. Bradley has to start attracting younger, next generation fans now. The lack of a student section is another huge detractor. I remember the glory days when the student section was packed. Who remembers the students making fun of Nolan Richardson and his polka dot jackets? They brought energy and they brought excitement. Bradley should be doing everything they can (free tickets, free transportation, deals with downtown businesses) to get students to PCC for games. If they aren't going to do that, move the games back on campus and accept the fact that you'll have smaller crowds that sound louder than what we have now but also accept that you're never going to draw good competition to Peoria for home games.
Thanks for the thoughts. But, again, Bradley has been trying to attract younger fans for the last 20 years, and it has not done much. They have always had a student section at the Civic Center prior to this season, and in addition they give the students free tickets, a free bus ride, parties, free snacks, free drinks, special student promotions, and much more, and as you can see, the student attendance at games is minimal. Everyone agrees they need to try to get younger fans, and they have tried. But nothing has worked. They just aren't interested. Even when Joanne Glasser tried playing a game or two at the Renaissance Coliseum in 2013-14 and 2014-15 coupled with student rallies, promotions, free food & drinks, and giveaways, only about a dozen or so students came to the games. She even visited dorms, fraternities, and sororities and dressed herself up in that ridiculous striped overalls outfit to try to whip up enthusiasm, but it failed. If anyone has a better idea, let Bradley know.
BUSongwriter
New member
It will take championships, or at least the possibility of championships, to get the community revved about Bradley basketball again. I believe if Bradley would have won the road games they should have won -- Belmont and Murray -- they would have started drawing crowds of 5,000-plus at Carver as they moved up the NET rankings as a Top 50 team. But instead, just when the Braves seem on the cusp of generating excitement beyond the loyal-but-reduced fan base, they lay an egg on the road and the excitement balloon deflates.
Win a regular season championship. Twenty-five years is ridiculous for this school and this community. Do so, and the stands will fill, and you'll even see more people in the community buying and wearing Bradley merch. But if we can't contend in an MVC with no team within sniffing distance of national rankings, the excitement beyond the loyal fans just won't happen.
Win a regular season championship. Twenty-five years is ridiculous for this school and this community. Do so, and the stands will fill, and you'll even see more people in the community buying and wearing Bradley merch. But if we can't contend in an MVC with no team within sniffing distance of national rankings, the excitement beyond the loyal fans just won't happen.
DC, how many conference games do we fly to? What parameters does the school use to determine this.
It has varied depending who the coach was and who the AD was that has to approve the extra cost of a flight. The team, and most teams, do not fly commercial, because they don't want to deal with the added time, cramped seating (lots worse on 6'9" guys), dealing with connections (not many non-stop, direct options out of PIA), dealing with luggage issues, etc. So if they fly, they charter a jet out of Byerly Aviation. Then it depends on the length of the trip, and how the extra time a bus trip might affect lost classroom time. Here is what one former coach told me...
The men's team has always flown to Missouri State, Wichita State, and Creighton, as far as I know. I believe they flew to Belmont this year (would have been a 7 hour drive), and Murray, KY. Evansville and Drake (5 hour drives) must be their limit for a bus trip, since I recall a couple times in the past when they've flown to those cities, but usually they bus to Des Moines and Evansville. And, they always bus to ILSU, INSU, UIC/Loyola, UNI, SIU, and Valparaiso.
Bradley has had former coaches who hated bus trips so much that they demanded flights to even closer places like Carbondale, which is a 4 hour drive. But I think budgets now usually determine that. Stan Albeck came to Bradley from the Chicago Bulls, where every trip was a charter flight (other than maybe Milwaukee). So he really hated doing long bus trips. But pretty much all of Bradley's former coaches disliked bus trips to some degree.
I was fortunate to get to go on a number of the team charter flights in the past. Charter flights are an unbelievable difference from flying commercial. You get to the charter terminal a few minutes before takeoff, someone verifies your are on the passenger list, takes your luggage, you board and take off. It all takes only a few minutes. Charters are also smaller and faster than commercial airplanes. The flight to Springfield, MO (~300 miles) took about 30-35 minutes between takeoff and touchdown. The luggage is always taken care of for you by the charter people and the bus people, and things move very quickly. The team was in their hotel rooms about a hour after takeoff from Peoria. Compare that with a 6 hour drive, or a commercial flight that includes several additional hours spent in airports and baggage claim.
The men's team has always flown to Missouri State, Wichita State, and Creighton, as far as I know. I believe they flew to Belmont this year (would have been a 7 hour drive), and Murray, KY. Evansville and Drake (5 hour drives) must be their limit for a bus trip, since I recall a couple times in the past when they've flown to those cities, but usually they bus to Des Moines and Evansville. And, they always bus to ILSU, INSU, UIC/Loyola, UNI, SIU, and Valparaiso.
Bradley has had former coaches who hated bus trips so much that they demanded flights to even closer places like Carbondale, which is a 4 hour drive. But I think budgets now usually determine that. Stan Albeck came to Bradley from the Chicago Bulls, where every trip was a charter flight (other than maybe Milwaukee). So he really hated doing long bus trips. But pretty much all of Bradley's former coaches disliked bus trips to some degree.
I was fortunate to get to go on a number of the team charter flights in the past. Charter flights are an unbelievable difference from flying commercial. You get to the charter terminal a few minutes before takeoff, someone verifies your are on the passenger list, takes your luggage, you board and take off. It all takes only a few minutes. Charters are also smaller and faster than commercial airplanes. The flight to Springfield, MO (~300 miles) took about 30-35 minutes between takeoff and touchdown. The luggage is always taken care of for you by the charter people and the bus people, and things move very quickly. The team was in their hotel rooms about a hour after takeoff from Peoria. Compare that with a 6 hour drive, or a commercial flight that includes several additional hours spent in airports and baggage claim.
Great info, thanks.
BradleyBiz
New member
I can't imagine what the cost would be to do a major capital project like this. Especially now. This should have been done when it was built. Plus the addition of restrooms, security infrastructure, additional entrances and exits, ramps/elevators, etc. That seems like it is a huge price tag. IMO, that is going to be a tough fundraising ask unless there are naming rights involved.
There are three options. 1) Increase attendance at the Civic Center soon. Not likely, given the history. 2) Move to the RC to control costs and keep the revenue. Fill the place and there will be demand for tickets. If there is significant demand, add 2,000 seats to meet demand. 3) Drop down to Division 3 and play all games at the RC. It's always about the money and money will determine the future of Bradley basketball.
Going to D3 is not an option. Plus I'm sure worst case is D2, but I don't see either of those being realistic.
Unfortunately, I don't think anyone other than the students can change this. They need a strong student run organization, with people that want to improve it. They know what motivates students.
I just finished watching the Kansas / K State game. K State wins by 1 in OT. Best part of the game? Watching and listening to the students. Oh, to have that kind of attendance and engagement again at Bradley. Like a few games I can remember when Carver was SRO.
I've had season tickets in four different locations at Carver, going back to the beginning. Upper bowl first, then two locations in the lower bowl, then during the Ford debacle I moved back to the upper bowl. Found two seats that actually have a better view than we ever had in the lower bowl. I was pleasantly shocked this year when Bradley lowered the cost to $75 per ticket. If $75 season ticket prices (and no maintenance) won't bring people back, it can't be just cost that's keeping people away.
Sorry to ramble. I think there's only one thing that will bring crowds back to Carver Arena, and make it sustainable. Winning. Not just an occasional trip to the NCAA by winning the tournament, not having good home streaks but embarrassing ourselves on the road, but winning the Valley. A lot. As much as I want that to happen, I don't see it on the horizon, and I'm afraid it's inevitable we will move to the RC. Better to fill the RC than lose money with a 1/3 full Carver.
I've had season tickets in four different locations at Carver, going back to the beginning. Upper bowl first, then two locations in the lower bowl, then during the Ford debacle I moved back to the upper bowl. Found two seats that actually have a better view than we ever had in the lower bowl. I was pleasantly shocked this year when Bradley lowered the cost to $75 per ticket. If $75 season ticket prices (and no maintenance) won't bring people back, it can't be just cost that's keeping people away.
Sorry to ramble. I think there's only one thing that will bring crowds back to Carver Arena, and make it sustainable. Winning. Not just an occasional trip to the NCAA by winning the tournament, not having good home streaks but embarrassing ourselves on the road, but winning the Valley. A lot. As much as I want that to happen, I don't see it on the horizon, and I'm afraid it's inevitable we will move to the RC. Better to fill the RC than lose money with a 1/3 full Carver.
-15 NIT and NCAA bids in the last 19 seasons is a good start.
-Averaging 23 win per season over the past 19 years.
-Never finishing worst than 3rd in the last 19 seasons, including 17 1st and 2nd place finishes.
And they parlayed all of that to move to a bigger basketball-centered conferece.