What will make attendance better?

[BUBraves2006]

I have been thinking about this topic for awhile and felt like it's worth bringing up again to see how people feel now. From last night's game thread:

Attendance was 3,905 - that is the lowest attendance for an MVC game at home this season.

I am admittedly spoiled attending during the glory time (2002-2006). Looking at this thread:
https://www.bradleyfans.com/forum/s...019-2020-season-ranking-among-all-d-1-schools

It shows that we were still getting 9K fans up until 2010. I will try to summarize the reasons for why I think the dropoff has happened, but please add if I missed anything:

• The team was absolutely awful for about 5 years and losing teams usually lose some level of attendance
• Some donors were really angry about the exit of Les, previous administration, how lousy of a coach Geno Ford was, etc.
• 2020 ruined sports for everyone with canceled games, weird rules to attend events, etc.
• General apathy for attending live events in general
• Trends towards such a high percentage of fans not staying in the area, having many fans not be local to attend in person (I fall in this camp, I'd be a STH if I wasn't hours from Peoria.)

While all these things are at least somewhat understandable, I'm not sure why things haven't surged back more. To counter the points above:

• The team is GREAT at home. Long winning streak and some really exciting players to watch - I don't recall a high flyer like Hannah since Zach Andrews
• The old administration is gone. We have good/great leadership based upon who you ask and time should heal this stuff. Can't imagine people are perpetually angry at people who aren't there anymore?
• 2020 is far in the rearview mirror and for the most part, people have resumed to normal life and people are appreciating what they lost when they couldn't attend stuff.

This raises a few more questions for me to help address the problem, or at least discuss it:

• Why is there no student section? I know there was some reason for putting tables in or whatever at the time, but this is just silly at this point. For one, if you don't have a student section, you're never going to attract new fans. I have numerous people who attended when I did who are always looking to attend games in our geographic area (Chicago in my case) and these people would never have those experiences without having it being a part of their college life.
• Is there even an effort to get students to attend? It was so simple when I attended - there were Peoria Charter buses sitting outside the student center before every home game. Piece of cake to attend. There has to be some outreach to make it a "thing". Organize stuff downtown or even do a collaboration with bars (this is not out of the question as it happened in our time with Hoops and a few other places). There has to be a way to get people to come to games if you make it the "thing to do".
• If there is some resignation to just not ever getting back to the levels of before, why not consider going back to campus? You have to imagine you could get way more students if all they have to do is roll out of the dorms and frat houses to go. It holds 4,200 and could be very loud and a huge home advantage, even more than Carver.

I just watch games from afar and while I love this team and my alma mater, I'm sad about the state of fan engagement at games. I have nieces and nephews in college now at other schools and if I had to encourage someone to go somewhere, I would have previously really pushed BU because of how awesome the basketball experience was. Now, I wonder if I could do that in good conscience. Obviously, sports fandom isn't dead. I see big student attendance at other schools (even ones not WAY bigger than ours).

 

[BRAVE82]

It is embarrassing. We sold out the fieldhouse (7,401) every game even when Bradley was terrible. There were many years of mediocre basketball at Carver and we still had 8,500. Sadly I think most of the Bradley fans have died over the last 20 years and have not been replaced. Also, the ability to watch the games online from anywhere hurts attendance. The internet has been a two edged sword. We are not the only ones that are experiencing this... just look at all the other mid-majors. Indiana State is in first place and their big game last night against SIU was watched by an empty stadium. Northern Iowa has had great teams for many years and they draw less than we do. America is a fat, lazy country. Getting anybody to get up off the couch and work (or do anything) has become increasingly difficult.

 

[Da Coach]

I updated the list of attendance figures over the past 45+ seasons, and included the 10 home games played so far this season.
Despite several low-cost ticket promotions this season, unless we get a substantial increase in attendance for the remaining games, Bradley is headed for the lowest average attendance this season since probably before Bradley moved out of the old Armory building.

Year/rank/Gms..total.....avg....change
2023........10....40,971..4,097 down 254 (through first 10 home games)
2022........14....60,912..4,351 down 1,300
2021……...14…..….0………..0…….....……(Covid season)
2020........17….96,059..5,651 up 222
2019........16….86,871..5,429 down 270
2018 .......15….85,489..5,699 up 212
2017 #96 15 82,318 5,487 down 466 (all games at Carver)
2016 #91 15 89,299 5,953 up 227 (all games at Carver)
2015 #94 16 91,614 5,726 down 882 (Carver average 5827)
2014 #74 17 112,335 6,608 up 51 (Carver average 6,984)
2013 #79 18 118,024 6,557 down 1,083
2012 #68 16 122,245 7,640 down 807
2011 #56 16 135,148 8,447 down 892
2010 #52 15 140,079 9,339 up 229
2009 #55 18 163,981 9,110 down 490
2008 #52 19 183,392 9,600 down 128
2007 #53 17 165,376 9,728 up 508
2006 #54 14 129,086 9,220 down 117
2005 #51 15 140,065 9,337 up 159
2004 #52 15 137,667 9,178 down 173
2003 #47 14 130,907 9,351 up 279
2002 #47 13 117,935 9,072 down 50
2001 #51 15 136,683 9,112 down 1,066
2000 #41 14 142,495 10,178 up 646
1999 #44 15 142,980 9,532 down 237
1998 #41 13 127,001 9,769 up 144
1997 #41 14 134,755 9,625 down 47
1996 #44 13 125,733 9,672 up 151
1995 #47 14 133,288 9,521 up 707
1994 #46 16 140,700 8,794 up 1,523
1993 #67 13 94,523 7,271 up 278
1992 #78 13 90,904 6,993 down 391
1991 #70 13 95,995 7,384 down 357
1990 #65 13 100,632 7,741 down 1,177
1989 #51 13 115,939 8,918 down 1,098
1988 #36 16 160,263 10,016 up 1,307
1987 #41 14 121,922 8,709 down 199
1986 #37 14 124,712 8,908 up 1,366
1985 #60 15 113,124 7,542 up 350
1984 #62 15 107,881 7,192 down 1,821
1983 #38 16 144,209 9,013 up 1,730
1982 #56 17 123,810 7,283 down 33
1981 #55 14 102,430 7,316 up 63
1980 #59 16 116,050 7,253 up 503
1979 #64 14 94,500 6,750 down 113
1978 #56 16 109,800 6,863

 

[BUfan17]

This is something that I have thought about as well.

I think there is just a lot more options for entertainment thanks to the internet. I can watch just about any sporting event, movie, or TV show I want instantly from the comfort of my home. Less demand for live entertainment, just being honest I don't think we will ever reach the level of attendance that we used to.

I think the younger generations in general are less into sports and the ones that are tend to be more extreme into them. Travel teams, practices, and camps happen all year long and take up a lot of time from anything else. Kids and their parents don't have the time they used to.

I was a student after you during the rather bad years for Bradley. The student enthusiasm just died off. Going to the games wasn't seen as the "cool" thing to do anymore. I understand It is tough going in to try to support a losing team year after year. Now that Bradley is back to a winning team I don't understand why there isn't a real student section.

If I were in charge of promotions I would be giving tickets free to greek life and other clubs/groups on campus. Make it a group thing to do. I think a lot of students have probably never even been to a basketball game, many hardly ever leave the west bluff. I am unsure what current efforts are happening on campus, is the Red Sea still a thing?

I think last night's attendance was lower than usual because it was a weeknight and Evansville is one of the worst teams in D1. Casual fans want to see an exciting game (competitive) and to see a win.

 

[molar50]

There are several factors as to the drop in attendance. Lack of marketing by Bradley, lack of student interest in sports, more entertainment choices than college sports, Geno, Cross, and Glasser, more competition for people’s money and time. This isn’t unique to Bradley, but the falloff in attendance has been precipitous and I do not see it improving. I think there should be serious thoughts and discussions about leaving the Civic Center and move to RC on campus. The money should be better for Bradley.

 

[BUfan17]

How to bring more fans in? I think they need to lower ticket prices across the board and make them easier to get.

Season tickets are another situation but I am talking about your average fan who comes to either zero to a few games each year and has to purchase tickets each time.

I was just looking at other venues around the Valley and Bradley seems to have the highest costs on average. Between the baskets in the lower bowl is $65 to $75. Around the valley these seem to be $20-$50. Is there any justification for these prices? Even on the sides of the lower bowl and parts of the upper bowl are $35.

To get tickets you have to either tack on the ridiculous extra fees if buying online through Ticketmaster(I think the civic center requires them), try using FEVO for the promotions (confusing and can't pick seats, only section) or waiting in a potentially long line to buy them from the box office before the game.

If Bradley is ok drawing the same 4000 person crowd size we might as well just play in Renaissance. Just about every game would be sold out, it would be an intimidating place to play for visiting teams.

 

[Big Mike]

One thing that stands out to me is schedule...some of the teams Bradley plays at home I've never heard of before. Bradley needs to play a Big 10 team or someone comparable to draw in a bigger attendance. Wardle went to Marquette, why not pull some strings, you might draw 7000 and bump your a average up...but you need a draw....:!::!::!:
Also the obvious...why does Bradley not draw any students to the games.....:doubt::doubt::doubt:

 

[algotrader]

When I go to Bradley games, I don't see too many people my age. Most of the fanbase I see is old(er). I see a lot of death notices on this board for older fans. Simply put, BU and the MVC have catered to the older generation of fans and put little effort into acquiring a younger fanbase. Even the format of this message board is.....dated.

If Bradley/the Valley's strategy involves having us "tune to DirecTV channel whatever", this will continue. Until the MVC gets serious about a cohesive media strategy revolving around media formats us younger fans use, this will continue. Because you're not going to get them to buy tickets if they're not fans to begin with. It isn't about winning, look at the Bears.

 

[Canton BU fan]

As someone who has been to almost every home game there is something that bothers me. Why does nearly the entire team have their heads down during the anthem? I can't be the only one to feel this way. If I was only a casual fan who randomly went to a game I may think twice about coming back.

 

[wily coyote]

As someone who has been to almost every home game there is something that bothers me. Why does nearly the entire team have their heads down during the anthem? I can't be the only one to feel this way. If I was only a casual fan who randomly went to a game I may think twice about coming back.

I will expand on your post. Most teams including ours do not place there hand over their heart. None of our kids do and i can except the non USA kids but not the rest of them. Last night ONE player from EU DID place his hand over his heart and it is rarely happening. It is something I watch every game. Our Coaches do but our players do NOT. Sorry if this doesn't bother you but if does me.

 

[braves16]

My big question is, what does it cost to rent the Civic Center, does Bradley get a cut of the concessions and parking? If it costs more to rent than what we are taking in, it might be time to consider playing on campus.
How many season ticket holders do we have now and what is the average age of a season ticket holder.
We and other Valley schools complain about poor newspaper coverage but what do you thing is the average age of someone who subscribes to a newspaper?
I'm guessing 65 plus.
I'll bet at least half the schools in the Valley could play in smaller arenas. Is it physically possible to expand Renaissance Coliseum to even 5000-5,500?
Everyone that has posted on this subject has brought up great points. Connor McCaffery, who plays at Iowa called out their fans earlier this year.
https://saturdaytradition.com/iowa-...llenge-to-iowa-fans-following-low-attendance/

 

[Da Coach]

How to bring more fans in? I think they need to lower ticket prices across the board and make them easier to get.

I think we have a winner here.... When the attendance plummeted because of the Glasser/Cross/Geno era, recall that we heard people say, "just win and the fans will come back". The administration in 2012 responded by raising ticket prices substantially, and attendance nosedived much more.
Well, Bradley is winning now, 17 straight, and the attendance keeps dropping to all-time lows.
The ticket prices are way too high. That, IMO, is the #1 reason.

My wife and I had a couple of guests with us last night, and they had a terrific time and greatly enjoyed watching the game. They are suddenly now big Bradley fans. They wanted to plan a few more future games, but when they learned what the ticket price is for the sidecourt seats, they aren't sure they can afford to go again.
Tickets in the lower bowl on the side court (sections 101,112,114,and 124) are listed at $65 each, but after fees and tax, are over $85 each. Tickets in sections 102 & 113 are listed even higher, $75 each, but become $97.80 each after paying the additional fees.
Upper bowl tickets are listed at $35 each, but become $48.60 after fees.
Available tickets for the next home game- https://www.ticketmaster.com/bradley...005D3C969A1410 (zoom in and cursor over any of the numerous available seats)
Yes, there are $10 tickets ($17.85 after fees are added), but those seats just don't generate the same enthusiasm nor create new fans.

I have been to every other MVC arena (except now Murray State) over the last couple decades, and never paid more than $30 for the ideal side-court lower bowl tickets. I recently went to the game at Belmont in Nashville, and paid $24 for great seats in row 4 directly behind the Bradley bench. Because I bought them directly from the Belmont website and not Ticketmaster, there were no additional fees. To summarize, if someone wanted to drive fans away, they would do exactly what Bradley is doing.

One thing that stands out to me is schedule...some of the teams Bradley plays at home I've never heard of before. Bradley needs to play a Big 10 team or someone comparable to draw in a bigger attendance. Wardle went to Marquette, why not pull some strings, you might draw 7000 and bump your a average up...but you need a draw....:idea::idea::idea:

Agree. The overall schedule has been better, but not the home schedule. It has been awful. Good teams don't want to play Bradley, and Bradley apparently is no longer willing to schedule 2 for 1 series. I don't think this will get better. In fact, if Bradley moves to the Renaissance Coliseum, it will get worse.

 

[tecon89]

Consistent winning I think has helped overall interest in the program compared to 5-10 years ago. Winning a game in the tournament I think would help drastically.

There are alot of Peoria folks who are Illini fans. Not sure why. I doubt many people
from Omaha are Nebraska fans. Not Many people from Wichita are Kansas fans. Speaking of…i think the Creighton and Wichita departures have hurt attendance. Those were big games. Nationally relevant programs coming to town really helps.

 

[egib52]

There is probably not one answer to this, but my thoughts are as follows:

1. The students that go to BU don't on average care much about sports. It has been a while since I was a student there, but it definitely still seems to be true.
2. Price is definitely a big deal.
3. From my experience coaching kids sports, and spending time with my friends' kids, many kids don't watch sports.
4. Game day experience. Go to an Illini game and you will see that ours is not even close. There used to be tshirt giveaways and half time acts. We don't see any of that anymore. They need to think outside of the box.
5. I would also argue that Carver needs a makeover or just move to the Colosseum.
6. More community engagement, and ideally more local players on the team (this obviously requires appropriate talent).

I just think they need to start thinking outside the box because if you look at how professional stadiums are changing there has to be some new elements that can be brought in.

 

[Da Coach]

My big question is, what does it cost to rent the Civic Center, does Bradley get a cut of the concessions and parking? If it costs more to rent than what we are taking in, it might be time to consider playing on campus.
How many season ticket holders do we have now and what is the average age of a season ticket holder.
We and other Valley schools complain about poor newspaper coverage but what do you thing is the average age of someone who subscribes to a newspaper?
I'm guessing 65 plus.
I'll bet at least half the schools in the Valley could play in smaller arenas. Is it physically possible to expand Renaissance Coliseum to even 5000-5,500?
Everyone that has posted on this subject has brought up great points. Connor McCaffery, who plays at Iowa called out their fans earlier this year.
https://saturdaytradition.com/iowa-f...ow-attendance/

I only know what Ken Kavanagh told me what the rental cost was per game back around 2008 or 2009 when he was AD. It was told to me in private and it has probably changed, so I won't post it publicly. But he also told me that Bradley got NONE of the parking and concession money, and that the break-even point for attendance was around 5,000-5,500 fans. Back then they had almost 9,000 season ticket buyers (full and partial) and they averaged nearly 10,000 fans per game, so it was very profitable.
Now, the season ticket base can't be much more than 3,000 if even that many (thanks JG :roll. And though we've been through a few re-negotiations of the Civic Center contract, I doubt the money split is much different. That means Bradley is losing money on every game. They cannot continue to lose like this for much longer.
Somewhere around 2010 or 2011, Joanne Glasser got mad at the Civic Center people and had the Engineering Department at Bradley do a feasibility study to see if the Renaissance Coliseum could be enlarged. They determined that balconies could be added to each side that would increase seating to around 6,000-6,200, and the cost would not be prohibitive.
At that time, Bradley had way more season ticket holders than 6,000, so nothing ever came of her idea. Dr. Cross referred to it in this chat session we had-
https://www.bradleyfans.com/forum/sp...691#post263691

Most of the fanbase I see is old(er). I see a lot of death notices on this board for older fans. Simply put, BU and the MVC have catered to the older generation of fans and put little effort into acquiring a younger fanbase. Even the format of this message board is.....dated.

And, sorry to vent, but to those who are blaming the drops in attendance on the "older fans" who actually do attend the games, or blaming Bradley for "catering" to the old people, that is complete BS. Everything about the games is catered to younger fans- the loud music, the intolerable hip-hop stuff, the loud, obnoxious MC, the promotional games for students during timeouts, the dance cam, the t-shirt toss, the kids' game ball presentation, and many other promotions, all the high-tech stuff like the scoreboard videos, and the flashing cell-phone strobe-light intros, the special ticket pricing for kids, and free stuff for students, and much more.
Us "old folks" would be there even if all that stuff disappeared, and it's the younger generations who shun quality live sports and stay home to watch the video stream, or play games on their PlayStation or text and socialize on electronic media. It's the older fans who buy the great majority of season tickets, and donate the overwhelming majority of money to support Bradley athletics. If not for the "older fans", Bradley would be where Valparaiso or Evansville are, or worse, maybe D2 or D3 by now.

 

[Tommy]

And, sorry to vent, but to those who are blaming the drops in attendance on the "older fans" who actually do attend the games, or blaming Bradley for "catering" to the old people, that is complete BS. Everything about the games is catered to younger fans- the loud music, the intolerable hip-hop stuff, the loud, obnoxious MC, the promotional games for students during timeouts, the dance cam, the t-shirt toss, the kids' game ball presentation, and many other promotions, all the high-tech stuff like the scoreboard videos, and the flashing cell-phone strobe-light intros, the special ticket pricing for kids, and free stuff for students, and much more.
Us "old folks" would be there even if all that stuff disappeared, and it's the younger generations who shun quality live sports and stay home to watch the video stream, or play games on their PlayStation or text and socialize on electronic media. It's the older fans who buy the great majority of season tickets, and donate the overwhelming majority of money to support Bradley athletics. If not for the "older fans", Bradley would be where Valparaiso or Evansville are, or worse, maybe D2 or D3 by now.

Couldn't agree with this more, Coach.

My thoughts on dropping attendance:
1. I believe we were on the rise until COVID, weren't we? Coach, can you confirm? COVID had a devastating effect on attendance for obvious reasons, and cost them a lot of season ticket holders, I'm sure. There are still many people that avoid social situations since the big COVID scare and being an older fanbase, this probably had an unusually large effect on BU. I think this is the single biggest effect on the attendance numbers personally.

2. Many season tickets are no doubt bought by companies/corporations. The company I work for purchases them every year and we've seen our company seats empty quite a few times, and I doubt they'd still be buying them every year if Dub were not in charge of it. At any rate, the COVID scare affected more than just older fans as people just got used to not going to games when they weren't allowed to and I'm sure this has caused many companies and individuals to give up their season tickets. I'd be curious to see how many season ticket holders have been lost were corporate/company purchases.

3. Season ticket prices go up every year. We've been in the same seats for quite some time now and they cost us more money every year. I used to buy multiple tickets, but now, I just buy one for myself and if I need more I buy the cheapest ones I can get and my guest(s) just move down by where we sit or we move somewhere else if there isn't enough room.

4. Just my feeling, but I've got to think that the pay for play and the no penalty transfers have discouraged some from coming as well. The way they've set it up, the mid-majors are going to feel like the recruiting fields for the power conferences and people are not going to want to see their team's best players leaving every year. I'll be honest, if that starts happening with BU, I'm not sure I'd continue to come, but I am optimistic that all of it will work itself out as I'm sure it will cause as many problems as solve for the big boys. Time will tell.

The comments below are all pretty insightful and bring up many good points. Winning helps, but intentionality would really help get the attendance back up and it just doesn't seem like there is much of a marketing push for BU basketball right now. They've done a few things like the kids free night, so let's hope they expand those type of events.

Also, the customer service seems to be an issue and I've seen a lot of complaints on this board about the ticket office and the Braves club in particular, just to name a couple. It would no doubt benefit them to do everything they can to go above and beyond in providing the best customer service possible to make it an easy and enjoyable experience, but I understand the reality is that its extremely difficult to get the type of employees that can excel in that area these days.

As far as moving to the Renaissance Coliseum, that is an interesting idea. Seats about 4200 people and that would be interesting to see how many would be filled with season ticket holders and how the pricing would work as you got closer to center court. Wasn't aware that Bradley didn't get any cut from concessions, so honestly wonder why they're still there. On the downside of the Coliseum, parking is terrible and getting in and out takes quite a bit more time, so I'd rather see them try to renegotiate a better contract with the Civic Center before making that move.

 

[Canton BU fan]

I will expand on your post. Most teams including ours do not place there hand over their heart. None of our kids do and i can except the non USA kids but not the rest of them. Last night ONE player from EU DID place his hand over his heart and it is rarely happening. It is something I watch every game. Our Coaches do but our players do NOT. Sorry if this doesn't bother you but if does me.

It's the heads down the whole anthem that got my attention more than hand on heart. Then at the same time recognize a verteran each game.

 

[Da Coach]

My thoughts on dropping attendance:
1. I believe we were on the rise until COVID, weren't we?

Yes, we were holding steady and starting to trend up slightly until the 2020-21 Covid year when no fans were allowed at any games.
Check the list of yearly attendance numbers in post #3 on the first page of this thread.-
https://www.bradleyfans.com/forum/sp...117#post506117

I don't know all the reasons for the substantial drop in these 2 seasons post-Covid ban on attendance, but maybe some of the fans learned how to stream, and got used to watching the games on TV, and now are slow to return to the live games. I know a few people who had never streamed anything in their life until that season, and they reluctantly learned how to stream ESPN+. A couple friends even had to buy "smart TVs", something they never thought they needed, in order to watch the streamed games. But I also believe the suggestions about fans getting older, retiring and moving away, or just losing interest, continued fear concerning Covid, and the younger fans lack of interest in live sports events all are part of the reason for the drops.

 

[The Old Guy]

I suggest that Chris Reynolds and Brian Wardle meet with a group consisting of Fraternity and Sorority presidents plus student Senate officers and honestly discuss why students don’t attend games and what needs to happen to get students to attend. Then the Athletic Dept needs to follow up on the suggestions and make their best effort to follow the students suggestions.

 

[braves16]

The Illinois State game should always be on a Saturday both home and away.