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Does this seem fair?

Da Coach

Da Coach

Moderator
Staff member
Patrick O'Bryant's penalty was 30% of the team's games ( 8 games in his case). This was for accepting a few hundred dollars more on his paycheck, which he didn't know was wrong. It came from his boss, who is not a Bradley booster or member of the Chiefs' club. It didn't affect his decision to come to Bradley out of high school. He repaid the amount as soon as it was discovered to be improper. Bradley reported and investigated it themselves and admitted the wrongdoing and made sure restitution was made.

Kansas' Darnell Jackson received thousands of dollars of illegal benefits (including cash in the form of a "loan"), most of it while he was still in high school, from a well known Kansas booster who is also a graduate of Kansas. Kansas had just come off a self imposed probation for numerous violations last summer, and has also had a number of well publicized legal problems with their players. There is little doubt that all the gifts and cash he received influenced Jackson to commit to Kansas. He still hasn't paid the money back yet. Yet the penalty for all this was 30% of Kansas' games this season. Exactly the same as POB.

http://www.kusports.com/news/mens_basketball/story/116150

http://www.kansan.com/stories/2005/nov/16/jackson_suspended_ncaa/
 
If I was Bradley I would never self report again and then told the players you might as well keep the money because you are going to get the same punishment.
 
Life is not fair as you well know Coach....except it, learn from it and move on. Takes steps to not let it happen again and make a negative into a positive.

I think we will.....you grow from mistakes and lessons learned. In the BIG picture these guys will be better people because of this. Welcome to college and higher learning.
 
Re: Does this seem fair?

Da Coach said:
Patrick O'Bryant's penalty was 30% of the team's games ( 8 games in his case). This was for accepting a few hundred dollars more on his paycheck, which he didn't know was wrong. It came from his boss, who is not a Bradley booster or member of the Chiefs' club. It didn't affect his decision to come to Bradley out of high school. He repaid the amount as soon as it was discovered to be improper. Bradley reported and investigated it themselves and admitted the wrongdoing and made sure restitution was made.

Kansas' Darnell Jackson received thousands of dollars of illegal benefits (including cash in the form of a "loan"), most of it while he was still in high school, from a well known Kansas booster who is also a graduate of Kansas. Kansas had just come off a self imposed probation for numerous violations last summer, and has also had a number of well publicized legal problems with their players. There is little doubt that all the gifts and cash he received influenced Jackson to commit to Kansas. He still hasn't paid the money back yet. Yet the penalty for all this was 30% of Kansas' games this season. Exactly the same as POB.

http://www.kusports.com/news/mens_basketball/story/116150

http://www.kansan.com/stories/2005/nov/16/jackson_suspended_ncaa/
Click to expand...

Well, Kansas is in the Big XII, a so-called "high-major" conference. Bradley is in the MVC, a so-called "mid-major" conference (according to some :roll: ). This means that it is fair. :-P
 
I don't understand the question. Where has it ever been written or documented that the NCAA will deal with issues fairly regardless of the school involved? The lady holding the scales of justice at the NCAA has never worn a blindfold. :?
 
The writer of that Scout article makes some good points. But he starts out criticizing Bradley and listing a number of events that Bradley had very little to do with. I wouldn't exactly put blame and shame on Bradley for the Granger situation (shouldn't McKay and Broussard be the ones shamed?) nor for the others leaving (Rembert and Stemler? I don't see anything wrong or shameful here.). And he seems to try to get some mileage out of the Sommerville transfer to Bradley. He implies some wrongdoing, when everyone involved has denied it and the NCAA found no merit to the claim.

Then the Jabbar Battle and Mike Suggs stories are resurrected. Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Bradley and Jim Les handle those 2 problems the right way? Battle was suspended and Suggs was kicked off the team.

I commend the writer for his strong stance toward the NCAA though.
 
Just my one cent - I think the writer was a hack. Disagreed with the writer til the end and left me confused on where he/she stands completely. Just like a political hack. No surprise really, as most in the press are a bunch of hacks. (In my opinion)
 
I thought I had heard that the NCAA had clearly defined rules that if a player received between x and y amounts of extra compensation they were out for 20% of the games and if they received between y and z amounts of extra money they were out for 30% of the games.

Franklin got between x and y, and O'Bryant between y and z. If my info is incorrect, then disregard, but the point is, Bradley broke a rule, and breaking that rule had a clearly set punishment. Anything that happens at Kansas or anywhere else is irrelevant, unfortunate, but irrelevant.

And this is coming from somebody who loves BU and hates Bill Self.
 
Roll with the Funches said:
I thought I had heard that the NCAA had clearly defined rules that if a player received between x and y amounts of extra compensation they were out for 20% of the games and if they received between y and z amounts of extra money they were out for 30% of the games.

Franklin got between x and y, and O'Bryant between y and z. If my info is incorrect, then disregard, but the point is, Bradley broke a rule, and breaking that rule had a clearly set punishment. Anything that happens at Kansas or anywhere else is irrelevant, unfortunate, but irrelevant.

And this is coming from somebody who loves BU and hates Bill Self.
Click to expand...



Good point and its one that I think most are trying to express....our "situation" APPEARS to be an honest mistake while KU's APPEARS to be a bit more shady.

I used to have a professor that told his students......if you report late or don't come to class at all I don't care why. You are either here or you are not. He didn't want to be put in the situation where he had to decide what excuse was valid and what wasn't AND who was lieing and who wasn't.

It seems as if my prof. is know working for the NCAA. You either recieved "illegal" funds or you didn't.....
 
64NIT said:
Here's an article from the Bradley Scout on the suspensions. I think it includes some well-taken points.
http://buscout.com/ver5/sportsarticle.php?ID=79&date=2005-12-02
Click to expand...

I also take strong issue with a number of statements in this article, and the guy writing it clearly doesn't even know he has many of his facts wrong.
I'll list a few of his errors, and try to correct them and comment on a few others:


--He starts off referring to the recent issue as "Bradley's most recent issue". But the NCAA has stated clearly that Bradley committed NO infraction, and only the Student Reinstatement Committee got involved, labelling this issue one of student non-compiance with rules that regard impermissable benefits. But, OK, if he wants to count this issue as Bradley's, then the next couple mistakes cannot be defended.


--He states, "The first issue came directly as a result of Les???‚¬?„? hiring, as star forward Danny Granger decided to transfer to New Mexico."
WRONG, as Granger's transfer to New Mexico came 10 months AFTER Les' hiring and was NOT a direct result of it, but a result of a lot of complex things that happened in between.


--Granger was talking by phone with Ritchie McKay? How does Matt Styka know this? This has never been alleged or revealed, and only Duane Broussard's phone records showed any calls to Granger. (I'm beginning to think this writer doesn't check any of his facts.)


--In regard to the Sommerville accusations, the writer fails to note that almost all the accusations of tampering were hinged on the testimony of Sommerville's father, who later recanted & stated to the press that his prior statements were incorrect, and that Les nor Buescher never contacted Cellus until after he left Iowa. Even the Iowa folks never made any official charge of tampering, only one member the local press in Peoria did, and now even he is retired and somewhat discredited.


--He makes a deal out of "Other players have moved in and out
of the program for various reasons". Like he can name a D-I program anywhere in America that this isn't true?


--In the Jabbar Battle situation, Les suspended the player, then rarely ever used him again the rest of the season. And yet the Scout had reported:
"Jabbar Battle struck his girlfriend hard enough to break the skin"
and
"suspend her attacker from an extracurricular activity for a grand total of an hour and 20 minutes."
(from the Scout, 11/14/2003)

But of course these statements were wrong, also.
I am in no way justifying the attack, but the official police report states the girlfriend had minor cuts on the inside of her mouth and mentions nothing about injury breaking the skin.
Also, duh....basketball games are not one hour long, they are only 40 minutes long, so the suspension of Battle was technically 80 minutes of playing time, not one hour and 20 minutes.


--Not sure how and why he ties right from Rembert leaving into O'Bryant's pay situation. There isn't a connection imaginable other than by this writer.


--Then after all this rambling effort to scold Bradley for what this writer sees as ethical problems,
of all things, this guy actually proposes BU should have been dishonest!!
Here are some of his final statements:
"Now, the question arises whether or not a university should ever be honest and admit fault"
"there is no incentive for the athletes, coaches or administrators to be honest in the future."
"Maybe Bradley needs to cover up any future problems from public eyes"
 
I found this article about the Darnell Jackson story. He is the Kansas recruit that received over $5000 in cash and gifts from a well known Kansas booster and graduate while he was in high school. He claims it didn't have anything to do with his decision to attend Kansas. Yeah, right. Jackson got the same penalty as Patrick O'Bryant -suspended for 30% of their games.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/sports/13427430.htm
 
Here is another case for the
"Does this seem fair" file.

The head coach at Oklahoma is Kelvin Sampson, thought by many to be as clean and untouchable in regards to ethics as any coach in America.

But here is the truth:

--The Oklahoma program has made over 550 impermissable phone calls to recruits since 2000, and possibly many more even before that.

--The NCAA knew about these phone calls as far back as 2001-2002 and yet they did not even begin to officially look into the situation until May of 2004.

--Oklahoma has played the old "Marathon Oil" team yearly in exhibitions (the team is now known as "Athletes First") and funneled money via such loophole to the AAU teams & players, with almost all the players on those AAU teams being the same ones that were called by the coaching staff illegally, showing an even stronger link to illegal recruiting, not just calling to wish the kid happy birthday. Now the NCAA disallows these games against amateur teams (any wonder?)

--The founder and coach of the Athletes First AAU team is a well known, long time Oklahoma booster, and several of those players have ended up at OU.

--One of the most recently hired Oklahoma assistants also was in trouble at his prior job, as Ray Lopes was fired as head coach at Fresno State in part for making over 400 impermissable phone calls there!!

--Even all the local (instate Oklahoma) press is owned and run by OU alums, so the media has pretty much swept the whole issue under the rug and ignores it.

--The present Oklahoma head coach, Kelvin Sampson, is a former president of the National Association of Basketball Coaches and well respected in NCAA circles, so is seemingly being left alone by those in power, even though over 200 of the impermissable phone calls are tied directly to Sampson, and he himself made them!!

--Here we are, more than 4 years into this whole thing, and everyone involved is in agreement that this amount of violations cause this issue to fall into the "Major Violations" category (plus the coverup), and yet there has been no action and no player or coach has yet missed or been penalized even one game!!

--In the same time interval that Oklahoma is apparently getting a pass on this whole thing, the entire investigation and penalties handed down have taken place at Baylor, Mizzou, Georgia, St. Bonavanture, and now Bradley (player suspensions) so have they (the NCAA) not had enough time to act?. Funny how Oklahoma with its popular coach who has strong ties to his old buddies over at the NCAA has been untouched over all this time, and now even the national writers have caught on to this travesty of justice. (see below)

DOES THIS SEEM FAIR?
http://www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/9153113
 
It is all about how much money your team makes the NCAA.If your team makes the NCAA a lot of money you can do anything you want that is just the way it is.
 
bu fan 9 said:
It is all about how much money your team makes the NCAA.If your team makes the NCAA a lot of money you can do anything you want that is just the way it is.
Click to expand...

Seems so.
As many severe violations that were rumored & that they ultimately did find when they
looked into Kentucky back a few years ago, it took cash falling out of an envelop at the
post office before the NCAA was embarrassed into looking into the situation instead of looking the other way.
In the end, most of the crooks got off pretty light and Eddie Sutton simply moved on the Oklahoma State.
Same true so far at Ohio State, where cash and friendly/sexual favors were thrown at recruits,
and they have yet to receive any significant penalty.
Add Mizzou, New Mexico, Duke, Arizona State, Michigan, Colorado, UNLV as schools where cash, sex, and academic
fraud were all used to get and reward their recruits, none of whom have had even one player or coach ever restricted from a game!!
(and don't count Ricky Clemons - who should never have been qualified to play at Mizzou in the first place)
 
user1 said:
Here is another case for the
"Does this seem fair" file.

The head coach at Oklahoma is Kelvin Sampson, thought by many to be as clean and untouchable in regards to ethics as any coach in America.

But here is the truth:

--The Oklahoma program has made over 550 impermissable phone calls to recruits since 2000, and possibly many more even before that.

--The NCAA knew about these phone calls as far back as 2001-2002 and yet they did not even begin to officially look into the situation until May of 2004.

--Oklahoma has played the old "Marathon Oil" team yearly in exhibitions (the team is now known as "Athletes First") and funneled money via such loophole to the AAU teams & players, with almost all the players on those AAU teams being the same ones that were called by the coaching staff illegally, showing an even stronger link to illegal recruiting, not just calling to wish the kid happy birthday. Now the NCAA disallows these games against amateur teams (any wonder?)

--The founder and coach of the Athletes First AAU team is a well known, long time Oklahoma booster, and several of those players have ended up at OU.

--One of the most recently hired Oklahoma assistants also was in trouble at his prior job, as Ray Lopes was fired as head coach at Fresno State in part for making over 400 impermissable phone calls there!!

--Even all the local (instate Oklahoma) press is owned and run by OU alums, so the media has pretty much swept the whole issue under the rug and ignores it.

--The present Oklahoma head coach, Kelvin Sampson, is a former president of the National Association of Basketball Coaches and well respected in NCAA circles, so is seemingly being left alone by those in power, even though over 200 of the impermissable phone calls are tied directly to Sampson, and he himself made them!!

--Here we are, more than 4 years into this whole thing, and everyone involved is in agreement that this amount of violations cause this issue to fall into the "Major Violations" category (plus the coverup), and yet there has been no action and no player or coach has yet missed or been penalized even one game!!

--In the same time interval that Oklahoma is apparently getting a pass on this whole thing, the entire investigation and penalties handed down have taken place at Baylor, Mizzou, Georgia, St. Bonavanture, and now Bradley (player suspensions) so have they (the NCAA) not had enough time to act?. Funny how Oklahoma with its popular coach who has strong ties to his old buddies over at the NCAA has been untouched over all this time, and now even the national writers have caught on to this travesty of justice. (see below)

DOES THIS SEEM FAIR?
http://www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/9153113
Click to expand...

Finally a little mention of Sampson and all the hundreds of NCAA violations that he has
committed, and even admitted to although he claims still claims it isn't cheating because everyone
else is doing it!
This story did appear in the PJ State today, but isn't in the online edition.
http://www.shns.com/shns/g_index2.cfm?action=detail&pk=BKC-TRAMEL-01-18-06
 
Another one for the "does this seem fair" file.

University of Kentucky guard Rajon Rondo
is seen tooling around campus driving a 2006 Yukon Denail, a car
worth $60,000!
But there's no need to worry that maybe anything suspicious is going on, because the univeristy has assured us the car
actually belongs to Rondo's good friend, NBA player and UK alum Derek Anderson,
who bought the car and let's Rajon use it all he wants!!

Gee-- I am sure glad it wasn't a few extra bucks from a summer employer, so it's nice to know it's just the free
use of a luxury car owned by an alumnus of UK.
http://www.kentucky.com/mld/kentucky/sports/basketball/13723546.htm
 
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