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Big East Catholic Schools Getting Restless

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Rusty 54

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The seven Big East Catholic, non-FBS schools met with Big East commissioner Mike Aresco Sunday to express their concerns for the direction of the conference, multiple Big East sources confirmed to ESPN.com Monday.

Sources said the New York meeting was the first among the seven schools (Marquette, DePaul, St. John's, Georgetown, Providence, Seton Hall and Villanova) and could ultimately lead to them splitting from the Big East's football members.
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http://espn.go.com/chicago/college-...ces-say?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

If this is the beginning of a new basketball-only conference, Cross and BU had better do whatever it takes to get in on it.

I'm tired of debates about the Valley getting more than one bid. I want to get back to winning conference championships, then success on a national level. If a new conference can help us get there, go for it. If the Valley schools with football aspirations are going to bail, I don't want BU to be left on a sinking ship.

No more focus groups or search committees. The time for strong leadership is now.
 
I figured this was a matter of time, but here it is finally. I totally agree that Dr Cross needs to get BU in on this shuffle before we're left behind playing Knox and Augustana (I know we won't drop down but you get the point).
 
No chance BU gets in with those schools if they all stick together and lead a new conference. Our best hope is they pick apart the A 10 and BU gets into a a second tier private hoops first conference. With the strong push this administration is doing to bump BU up from a regional institution to a national institution, I imagine we will do everything in our power to get in a strong conference as we see the power sports play in brand recognition.
 
This development is not likely to be good for a school like Bradley or most of the MVC schools. If these 7 Big East Catholic schools (Marquette, DePaul, St. John's, Georgetown, Providence, Seton Hall and Villanova) have any intention of breaking away from the Big East and starting their own major conference for basketball, there is little chance Bradley would be invited to join them. This could hurt the MVC because the only MVC school these Catholic schools would be interested in is Creighton. They would likely try to lure Creighton from the MVC, and probably a few A-10 schools like Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis, and possibly St. Joe's and St. Bonaventure.
 
Da Coach said:
This development is not likely to be good for a school like Bradley or most of the MVC schools. If these 7 Big East Catholic schools (Marquette, DePaul, St. John's, Georgetown, Providence, Seton Hall and Villanova) have any intention of breaking away from the Big East and starting their own major conference for basketball, there is little chance Bradley would be invited to join them. This could hurt the MVC because the only MVC school these Catholic schools would be interested in is Creighton. They would likely try to lure Creighton from the MVC, and probably a few A-10 schools like Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis, and possibly St. Joe's and St. Bonaventure.
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The 7 Schoools, plus Xavier, Creighton, and SLU makes perfect sense, it would easily be a top 5 BBall conference, all private, jesuit, it makes too much sense (Distance not withstanding). BU needs to make a move soon to align with the A-10 IMO, the only chance we get into the former big east conference is if they go 16 teams and make two divisions and they need more midwest teams, and even then it's a long shot. Either way, the MVC isn't going to be around as we know it much longer...
 
I've been trying to figure out the math for awhile.

The Catholic 7 will stick together. If for no other reason, because they need each other for the dissolution/separation process.

St Louis is a veritable lock for an invite (old CUSA pals of Marquette/DePaul, can be a western outpost).

Xavier is a veritable lock for what they bring to the table.

You can go to war with those 9. If Xavier wants a buddy, add Dayton. Butler is Butler. I think Richmond would have the upper hand on VCU. Or you can attempt the Creighton/Wichita package (I'm not sure they take just one of the two, just because of the geographical outlier thing. Creighton would be too much of a threat to be an albatross to the league).

Now, if Bradley gets an invite to A-10 v2.0, then we've got a discussion on our hands.
 
Exactly why a proactive stance is necessary......

If the BU administration wants to taste dust, well, keep the car in park.

Major efforts are necessary to improve our BRAND, WIN PERCENTAGE, ATTENDANCE, and NAME RECOGNITION.

I think we all know what will happen at the 3-5 year mark if we are playing in a 3rd or 4th Tier D1 conference without Creighton and Wichita State. This would be a DISASTER for athletic donations, attendance, and any national reputation.

We are not on the Tier of any of the nonfootball cast offs mentioned. The schools, including Creighton, have built their BRAND up and hold strong cards in conference realignments. So, they should be rewarded with $$$$ from TV revenue, etc...
 
TheAsianSensation said:
I've been trying to figure out the math for awhile.

The Catholic 7 will stick together. If for no other reason, because they need each other for the dissolution/separation process.

St Louis is a veritable lock for an invite (old CUSA pals of Marquette/DePaul, can be a western outpost).

Xavier is a veritable lock for what they bring to the table.

You can go to war with those 9. If Xavier wants a buddy, add Dayton. Butler is Butler. I think Richmond would have the upper hand on VCU. Or you can attempt the Creighton/Wichita package (I'm not sure they take just one of the two, just because of the geographical outlier thing. Creighton would be too much of a threat to be an albatross to the league).

Now, if Bradley gets an invite to A-10 v2.0, then we've got a discussion on our hands.
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So new Catholic 7 (+3) conference:
Dayton (Only non-Catholic school?)
DePaul
Georgetown
Marquette
Providence
St John's
St Louis
Seton Hall
Villanova
Xavier (Does Xavier join without Dayton?)

So who's in A-10 v2?
Bradley
Butler
Duquesne
Fordham
George Washington
LaSalle
Massachusettes
Rhode Island
Richmond
St. Bonaventure
St. Joes
VCU

I think I'd be very happy with that league, though we'd be in a sort of western outpost? Do Creighton and WSU get an invite also, or do they try to add Drake or Detroit Mercy?

Also, is it possible that the Catholic 7 would keep Dayton out to make a "real" Catholic league and invite St Joes instead?
 
thefish7 said:
So new Catholic 7 (+3) conference:
Dayton (Only non-Catholic school?)
DePaul
Georgetown
Marquette
Providence
St John's
St Louis
Seton Hall
Villanova
Xavier (Does Xavier join without Dayton?)

So who's in A-10 v2?
Bradley
Butler
Duquesne
Fordham
George Washington
LaSalle
Massachusettes
Rhode Island
Richmond
St. Bonaventure
St. Joes
VCU

I think I'd be very happy with that league, though we'd be in a sort of western outpost? Do Creighton and WSU get an invite also, or do they try to add Drake or Detroit Mercy?

Also, is it possible that the Catholic 7 would keep Dayton out to make a "real" Catholic league and invite St Joes instead?
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It's all going to depend on TV and markets. If duplicate markets matter or not, and how much TV money is available. That's kinda why I think St Joe's is screwed (Villanova). The Catholic schools will be giving up some money in all probability if they split - they need every dime from TV to help.

Your A-10 v2.0 is pretty close to what I would project as a reasonable scenario for Bradley. I think Fordham would get left behind, Richmond might jump to the Catholic conference if they decide to not be strict on the "Catholic" part, and I think Detroit would be a part of any A-10 v2.0, but that's just nitpicking.
 
thefish7 said:
So new Catholic 7 (+3) conference:
Dayton (Only non-Catholic school?)
DePaul
Georgetown
Marquette
Providence
St John's
St Louis
Seton Hall
Villanova
Xavier (Does Xavier join without Dayton?)

So who's in A-10 v2?
Bradley
Butler
Duquesne
Fordham
George Washington
LaSalle
Massachusettes
Rhode Island
Richmond
St. Bonaventure
St. Joes
VCU

I think I'd be very happy with that league, though we'd be in a sort of western outpost? Do Creighton and WSU get an invite also, or do they try to add Drake or Detroit Mercy?

Also, is it possible that the Catholic 7 would keep Dayton out to make a "real" Catholic league and invite St Joes instead?
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I think an all catholic league would be a very lucrative deal for those schools. Creighton is a Jesuit school, they'll get the invite right away to the Catholic league, likely with invites to St Joes and St Bonnie.
 
BUBalum05 said:
I think an all catholic league would be a very lucrative deal for those schools. Creighton is a Jesuit school, they'll get the invite right away to the Catholic league, likely with invites to St Joes and St Bonnie.
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I think Creighton is just too far away. For non-football schools, travel is pretty important I think. I don't really see St Bonnie as attractive, but maybe they'd make an offer?
 
TheAsianSensation said:
It's all going to depend on TV and markets. If duplicate markets matter or not, and how much TV money is available. That's kinda why I think St Joe's is screwed (Villanova). The Catholic schools will be giving up some money in all probability if they split - they need every dime from TV to help.

Your A-10 v2.0 is pretty close to what I would project as a reasonable scenario for Bradley. I think Fordham would get left behind, Richmond might jump to the Catholic conference if they decide to not be strict on the "Catholic" part, and I think Detroit would be a part of any A-10 v2.0, but that's just nitpicking.
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Would such a Catholic league lead to ND shenanigans, you think-- or is indpendent ND football DOA?

I'd think Detroit would be more attractive than Fordham, St Bonnie, or LaSalle. So would either Drake or E'ville too, if the A10 was thinking about cutting members and moving west. Do Mass and URI eventually get restless in a largely private conference? Are either a football threat long term? There's so many questions... hehe and I'm not at all knowledgeable enough to really answer many of them.
 
bdhove12 said:
Dayton is a Catholic school.
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Good call. I knew they were private, didn't realize they were Catholic. So that's a pretty great conference. Only question left is if St. Louis will want to join a conference that is that far "East." I think the answer is probably yes, because with Dayton and Xavier that is a fantastic basketball conference.
 
thefish7 said:
Would such a Catholic league lead to ND shenanigans, you think-- or is indpendent ND football DOA?

I'd think Detroit would be more attractive than Fordham, St Bonnie, or LaSalle. So would either Drake or E'ville too, if the A10 was thinking about cutting members and moving west. Do Mass and URI eventually get restless in a largely private conference? Are either a football threat long term? There's so many questions... hehe and I'm not at all knowledgeable enough to really answer many of them.
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UMass is an immediate football threat, I think the Big East football conference would be their endgame.

Rhode Island is more likely to move down than up as far as football goes.

Notre Dame will stay in the ACC as long as they can. There's more basketball value there anyways.

One thing I keep looking at is if the A-10 just restocks instead of splintering. All the Fordhams and LaSalles would be part of the conference with the new invitees in that case. I'm really not sure if the A-10 is mean enough to vote members out. That may cramp things more than I first expected.

One stealth option: Elgin invites St Joe's, St Bonaventure, Duquesne, G-Dub, VCU, and BUtler to form an eastern division of them plus the Indianas. Everyone else west. 16 team conference. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
 
What about A10 v2.1:

East
Duquesne
George Washington
LaSalle
Richmond
St Bonnie (or try to poach George Mason)
St Joe's
VCU

West
Bradley
Butler
Detroit
Drake
Creighton
Wichita St
Pick-em from Evansville, Loyola-IL, Valpo, Wright St (or SLU if they didn't join Catholic League for some reason).

Play a h/h each season in division, and an alternating game out of divison for 19 conference games each season without travel that's too destructive. Could also drop a team in each division (St Bonnie, or the pick-em unless it's SLU) and have a 17 game conference schedule. That would be a sweet conference.
 
Xavier and Butler have been widely known to be the Big East privates first choices when this comes to pass. This was discussed more than a year ago on a conference call that was leaked all over the place (specifically on Marquette, Georgetowm, and Providence message boards)

Its about basketball cache and staying relevant for rights packages. Being Catholic (or even private) is secondary to having weight
 
thefish7 said:
What about A10 v2.1:

East
Duquesne
George Washington
LaSalle
Richmond
St Bonnie (or try to poach George Mason)
St Joe's
VCU

West
Bradley
Butler
Detroit
Drake
Creighton
Wichita St
Pick-em from Evansville, Loyola-IL, Valpo, Wright St (or SLU if they didn't join Catholic League for some reason).

Play a h/h each season in division, and an alternating game out of divison for 19 conference games each season without travel that's too destructive. Could also drop a team in each division (St Bonnie, or the pick-em unless it's SLU) and have a 17 game conference schedule. That would be a sweet conference.
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This would be a very solid conference. Let the domino falling begin! :D
 
Indy_BB said:
Xavier and Butler have been widely known to be the Big East privates first choices when this comes to pass. This was discussed more than a year ago on a conference call that was leaked all over the place (specifically on Marquette, Georgetowm, and Providence message boards)

Its about basketball cache and staying relevant for rights packages. Being Catholic (or even private) is secondary to having weight
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Yeah I can see that, especially where Butler is concerned. That said, Xavier is going to want Dayton I think. It's a huge rivalry for them, and Dayton is no slouch... Also, though, not like there's some magic barrier at 10 teams, so they could easily target all three.
 
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Lets not get out of hand. The reason the Catholic schools are protesting is two fold. One the distance they will have to travel for all sports $$$ and second the perceived and real dilution of the Big East brand which also adds up to less $$$. I'm sure their AD's communicate with each other on a routine basis and decided as group they would have more leverage. I'm not betting they are after a Catholic school only basketball league. They will take into consideration distance, branding and TV market in formulating their next steps. Their best bet in order to create a dynamic and stable league is to create a 2 divisional 16 team conference. They will most probably look at branding, TV market and impact on overhead to their respective athletic department. I still see an east coast and mid-west division as the ideal situation. The question for us is, does BU may that cut? I have to believe CU, Butler, Xavier and SLU will along with Depaul and Marquette which leaves two slots for the mid-west.

Who would be vying for those slots?:
Detroit - brings a large TV market
Dayton - Catholic school but shared TV market with Xavier
Drake - Academic reputation decent TV market but not dynamic
BU - Academic reputation Ok TV market dynamic fan base
Valpo- Academic reputation not much more

There are other schools in the mix but for one reason or the other I left off. This will be a private school conference and it will be looking to build an academic foundation/brand around it. You can bet on that.

I'm going to give Detroit an edge due to TV market and the last slot is up for grabs and that is why BU needs to be proactive because its margin for error is very slim.
 
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