Rebounding and Taylor Brown

[BradleyBrave]

Would he really be making much of a difference in rebounding? Look at our rebounding margin for our first 3 games -

UT-Kingsville (DII) +1
NIU -14
LMU -17

So against two Division I teams (lower echelon DI teams), we're averaging -15.5 on the glass on our home court. Would Taylor Brown be averaging 15.5 RPG? Does anyone find this disturbing at all? Quite frankly it is mind-boggling that we're 3-0 with these numbers (among other stats, but this stands out the most to me), and my fear is that this is going to correct itself in a really, really bad way. Sadly, this is a stat that is more or less all about position and effort as opposed to shooting or scoring, which is more about coordination and skill. Sadly.

 

[Out of Balance]

Would he really be making much of a difference in rebounding? Look at our rebounding margin for our first 3 games -

UT-Kingsville (DII) +1
NIU -14
LMU -17

So against two Division I teams (lower echelon DI teams), we're averaging -15.5 on the glass on our home court. Would Taylor Brown be averaging 15.5 RPG? Does anyone find this disturbing at all? Quite frankly it is mind-boggling that we're 3-0 with these numbers (among other stats, but this stands out the most to me), and my fear is that this is going to correct itself in a really, really bad way. Sadly, this is a stat that is more or less all about position and effort. Sadly.

How right you are and I totally agree:!: But adding to the matter, is that we have 6'2 to 6'5 players going up against players that have 3 to 6 inchs of height on them and up to 30 lbs. on them to:!: Pretty hard to go a whole game and stand your ground against those odds without wearing down:!:
We got to match up to these issues and resolve them, plus, do all the above:!::!:

 

[Beninator]

Would he really be making much of a difference in rebounding? Look at our rebounding margin for our first 3 games -

UT-Kingsville (DII) +1
NIU -14
LMU -17

So against two Division I teams (lower echelon DI teams), we're averaging -15.5 on the glass on our home court. Would Taylor Brown be averaging 15.5 RPG? Does anyone find this disturbing at all? Quite frankly it is mind-boggling that we're 3-0 with these numbers (among other stats, but this stands out the most to me), and my fear is that this is going to correct itself in a really, really bad way. Sadly, this is a stat that is more or less all about position and effort as opposed to shooting or scoring, which is more about coordination and skill. Sadly.

TB probably makes a difference as far as substitution patterns and the type of lineup that put on the court. However, we miss a lot of opportunities for rebounds when our guards start to run to the other side of the court after we put up a missed shot.

 

[Braves4Life]

..... we miss a lot of opportunities for rebounds when our guards start to run to the other side of the court after we put up a missed shot.

That and the fact that the Les offensive sets and scheme does not lend itself to good offensive rebounding, IMO. The players are too helter-skelter and out of position once the shot goes up (on both offense and defense).

I've said it before and I'll say it again, for the Les scheme to be effective we really need to have a few good outside shooters on offense and an eraser like POB to bail out players that get beat off of the aggressive double teaming. We saw how that worked out during the Sweet 16 run. That team was tailor-made for Les' offense.

 

[Beninator]

That and the fact that the Les offensive sets and scheme does not lend itself to good offensive rebounding, IMO. The players are too helter-skelter and out of position once the shot goes up (on both offense and defense).

I've said it before and I'll say it again, for the Les scheme to be effective we really need to have a few good outside shooters on offense and an eraser like POB to bail out players that get beat off of the aggressive double teaming. We saw how that worked out during the Sweet 16 run. That team was tailor-made for Les' offense.

Very much agree!

 

[SaintLouBrave22]

That and the fact that the Les offensive sets and scheme does not lend itself to good offensive rebounding, IMO. The players are too helter-skelter and out of position once the shot goes up (on both offense and defense).

I've said it before and I'll say it again, for the Les scheme to be effective we really need to have a few good outside shooters on offense and an eraser like POB to bail out players that get beat off of the aggressive double teaming. We saw how that worked out during the Sweet 16 run. That team was tailor-made for Les' offense.

While I agree about needing good outside shooters, I have to disagree about why we don't rebound well offensively...we tend to chuck a shot and then 4 guys back pedal to the other end of the floor...this isn't going to help the best rebounding team in the country get boards...

Oh and btw, did anyone notice that not only did we rebound better but we made up the difference AND took the lead for good when AT and Will were out there together? Makes a huge difference when you have to check off two guys in the lane and on the glass.

 

[Da Coach]

Would he really be making much of a difference in rebounding? Look at our rebounding margin for our first 3 games -

UT-Kingsville (DII) +1
NIU -14
LMU -17

So against two Division I teams (lower echelon DI teams), we're averaging -15.5 on the glass on our home court. Would Taylor Brown be averaging 15.5 RPG? Does anyone find this disturbing at all? Quite frankly it is mind-boggling that we're 3-0 with these numbers (among other stats, but this stands out the most to me), and my fear is that this is going to correct itself in a really, really bad way. Sadly, this is a stat that is more or less all about position and effort as opposed to shooting or scoring, which is more about coordination and skill. Sadly.

I know you know this, but Taylor wouldn't have to average 15 rpg to make these games even. There are a number of other ways his presence would make a difference in Bradley's rebounding.
-First, TB would be grabbing a lot of those rebounds that are going to the opponents
-Also, if TB was playing, we would not have to rely on perimeter shooting so much, so there would be more shots made, and less available rebounds for the opponent
-also, he is one of our more physical players and a difficult matchup for the opponents. Thus, just his presence under the boards keeps opponents from grabbing so many rebounds. That makes Will, Jordan and the other Braves better rebounders, and they all increase their averages.
-and finally, TB would greatly improve our interior defense as well as offense, reducing the number of rebounds at our end and increasing the number at the opponents end. That would favor Bradley's rebounding margin, too.

 

[Buesch N Chips]

Also, I don't want to make this Math 105 again, and I am no genius to feel free to correct me, but if we have a -14 differential, we would only have to get 7 more rebounds to make it even. For every extra rebound we get, they get one less.

 

[mrcoachdude]

Would he really be making much of a difference in rebounding? Look at our rebounding margin for our first 3 games -

UT-Kingsville (DII) +1
NIU -14
LMU -17

So against two Division I teams (lower echelon DI teams), we're averaging -15.5 on the glass on our home court. Would Taylor Brown be averaging 15.5 RPG? Does anyone find this disturbing at all? Quite frankly it is mind-boggling that we're 3-0 with these numbers (among other stats, but this stands out the most to me), and my fear is that this is going to correct itself in a really, really bad way. Sadly, this is a stat that is more or less all about position and effort as opposed to shooting or scoring, which is more about coordination and skill. Sadly.

Yes he would be making a BIG difference....like its been stated...impact is not just pure rebounds...

 

[amckillip]

Would he really be making much of a difference in rebounding? Look at our rebounding margin for our first 3 games -

UT-Kingsville (DII) +1
NIU -14
LMU -17

So against two Division I teams (lower echelon DI teams), we're averaging -15.5 on the glass on our home court. Would Taylor Brown be averaging 15.5 RPG? Does anyone find this disturbing at all? Quite frankly it is mind-boggling that we're 3-0 with these numbers (among other stats, but this stands out the most to me), and my fear is that this is going to correct itself in a really, really bad way. Sadly, this is a stat that is more or less all about position and effort as opposed to shooting or scoring, which is more about coordination and skill. Sadly.

Your math is inherrently wrong. TB would only have to add 7.25 rebounds (he could easily average that) per game to make it even, because he would be adding one for BU and subtracting one from the opponent (Shaun, back me up!!) He could easily do that. So, another shot a JL that isn't valid. I really question JL's ability to consistenly produce, and his system will leave us on the wrong side of the rebounding margin, but that doesn't matter, only scoring margin. However, I am not going to make up scenarios in which he is deficient and try to make it seem outrageous.

 

[SFP]

TB would make a difference but even with him the team is rebound challenged. There are guys that love to board and have made a living doing just that. TB was a good rebounder not great because he also did not have the right attitude about doing what it takes, to get the ball. Defensive rebounding is about team work and putting your body between you and the ball and then going for it but if one person takes that play off no matter how well you personally did your job, a guy on the other team can sneak right in. On the offensive side it is all about desire and coming in from the weak side. There is a science behind rebounding.

 

[shaunguth]

Your math is inherrently wrong. TB would only have to add 7.25 rebounds (he could easily average that) per game to make it even, because he would be adding one for BU and subtracting one from the opponent (Shaun, back me up!!)

That's true. Another factor would be who's minutes he would be getting and therefore, who's rebounds he would also need to make up for. As has been pointed out, that shouldn't be much of a problem either.

 

[real fan]

TB would make a difference but even with him the team is rebound challenged. There are guys that love to board and have made a living doing just that. TB was a good rebounder not great because he also did not have the right attitude about doing what it takes, to get the ball. Defensive rebounding is about team work and putting your body between you and the ball and then going for it but if one person takes that play off no matter how well you personally did your job, a guy on the other team can sneak right in. On the offensive side it is all about desire and coming in from the weak side. There is a science behind rebounding.

Problem we have with teaching our players to block out is they back their guy out away from the rebound and then another player comes in from the opposing team and gets the ball, has happened several times this season, they need to just stay in front of their guy while going up to get the rebound.

 

[mrcoachdude]

Problem we have with teaching our players to block out is they back their guy out away from the rebound and then another player comes in from the opposing team and gets the ball, has happened several times this season, they need to just stay in front of their guy while going up to get the rebound.

That happened once vs NIU and JL was livid...saw him get into a couple of players....Believe the phrase was ...we all need to hold the block out...

 

[srw]

Don't really want to get in this squabble either but a couple of things...

Taylor would certainly help, but remember a rebound he gets can only account for one that the player replacing him didn't get....
so the net add is only the difference.


That said...his athleticism is missed. When you look at the post players numbers they aren't terrible, so i have to wonder if the guards are getting killed

 

[bigdaddystuck]

I might be wrong...

but if you compare our defensive rebounding #'s and the opponents offensive rebounding #'s (basically their chances at 2nd chance points) we are winning that battle. We are averaging 23 defensive rebounds per game and the opposition is averaging 12 offensive rebounds per game. So if I am correct we are limiting their 2nd chance points. Which is good.

The problem lies in our offensive rebounding. The averages are 10.3 for BU and 31.3:-o for the opponents.

I think we have the ability to rebound, evidence by the defensive numbers. The way we run the offense which is pretty much shoot and bail...limits our chances of getting an offensive rebound. This would not matter if we shot a high precentage, but at 38%, our shooting isn't going to get it done!

 

[dogsrus]

I might be wrong...

but if you compare our defensive rebounding #'s and the opponents offensive rebounding #'s (basically their chances at 2nd chance points) we are winning that battle. We are averaging 23 defensive rebounds per game and the opposition is averaging 12 offensive rebounds per game. So if I am correct we are limiting their 2nd chance points. Which is good.

The problem lies in our offensive rebounding. The averages are 10.3 for BU and 31.3:-o for the opponents.

I think we have the ability to rebound, evidence by the defensive numbers. The way we run the offense which is pretty much shoot and bail...limits our chances of getting an offensive rebound. This would not matter if we shot a high precentage, but at 38%, our shooting isn't going to get it done!

Interesting.....


My entire life has been "shoot and bail"....I goof something up...say shoot..then I bail before anyone finds out.

 

[Bradleyguy10]

Others probably mentioned this, at least I would hope, I haven't read other posts but your math is wrong.

If TB only added 4 more rebounds to the teams total by "theoretically" replacing our worst rebound, which is very conservative then NIU would have only outrebounded us by 6 and LMU by 9. That is assuming TB ONLY adds 4 more which he is likely to really add about 5 to 8 more than than someone he is replacing. Also increasing your likelihood of grabbing the first rebound decreases the likelihood of the opposing team grabbing ANOTHER rebound in the same offensive set which would make it even closer.

TB makes a large difference....case and point. I DO use injuries as a reason. It's fact that this team will not do as well if we had a healthy TB. Same as everyother year.

 

[Braves2011]

rebounding

rebounding

I would definitely say this team does miss and need TB as a rebounder. But watching the first game against Kingsville and watching NIU game on the replay. To me it seems like we just lock-up (tenseness) and then at times as everyone will say we only have 1 guy down there waiting for rebound then the other 4 are already back. Yes the size is an issue right now. Thats just my thoughts.

 

[BradleyBrave]

Your math is inherrently wrong. TB would only have to add 7.25 rebounds (he could easily average that) per game to make it even, because he would be adding one for BU and subtracting one from the opponent (Shaun, back me up!!) He could easily do that. So, another shot a JL that isn't valid. I really question JL's ability to consistenly produce, and his system will leave us on the wrong side of the rebounding margin, but that doesn't matter, only scoring margin. However, I am not going to make up scenarios in which he is deficient and try to make it seem outrageous.

I don't know why you're so paranoid to think every observation that isn't positive is some sort of premeditated shot at the coach. It isn't. We've stunk at rebounding for a while now, and we do this year through 3 games. It's not a shot at JL, it's an observation that's pretty well supported over the past several years. Dave Reynolds wrote about it heading into the season. Is he taking invalid shots too? I worry that our rebounding woes are going to come back to haunt us. How is that taking a shot at JL?