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Mark McGwire gets standing ovation!

I don't condone what McGwire did, but what he did takes courage. Not getting caught by a test (ramirez and others) and then forced to admit it, but not (truly) owing anything to anyone yet knowing what is right for yourself and for baseball and just going out there and doing it. No one is perfect and the only way you can truly be a role model is if you mess up and then own up to it. That's a real man...someone who can mess up and openly admit that they were wrong and that they are truly sorry. For that I respect him. He cheated and he regrets it. Time to move on cardinal nation. We can't change history.
 
Bradleyguy10 said:
I don't condone what McGwire did, but what he did takes courage. Not getting caught by a test (ramirez and others) and then forced to admit it, but not (truly) owing anything to anyone yet knowing what is right for yourself and for baseball and just going out there and doing it. No one is perfect and the only way you can truly be a role model is if you mess up and then own up to it. That's a real man...someone who can mess up and openly admit that they were wrong and that they are truly sorry. For that I respect him. He cheated and he regrets it. Time to move on cardinal nation. We can't change history.
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Do you think he regrets that he cheated or he regrets that he was caught?
 
That IS a very good question. But in reality he didn't really get "caught". I think when he took them they were kind of the "norm" which doesn't excuse it. I think he's upset that it became such a big deal now when in the past it wasn't as much of a big deal. Overall, I think McGwire has consistently shown that he tries to be a good person. No one succeeds at that. And for that I think he is legitimately upset that he ever got involved with them. I think there is more sting to it that he has to admit it, yes that's true, but still. But then again it is hard to regret doing something that gave you the ability to stay on the field and gain millions of dollars. He would've been well off either way.

In the end though I do think he regrets taking them because he has been in turmoil over it ever since leaving baseball. If he was fine during the 5 years and now its bugging him because of his admission you are probably right and I am wrong. For the most part though I think it has been digging into his conscious for a long long time and he's wanted to get it off his chest. That's the true sign of him caring that he did it in the first place rather than caring he got "caught". JMO
 
What bugged me about his confession is that he wanted to pass blame around to everyone instead of really being a man and saying what he did was wrong regardless of anyone or the climate of the game. Now that would have taken courage! He knew what he was doing at the time was wrong and so he should of manned up from the get go!
 
SFP said:
What bugged me about his confession is that he wanted to pass blame around to everyone instead of really being a man and saying what he did was wrong regardless of anyone or the climate of the game. Now that would have taken courage! He knew what he was doing at the time was wrong and so he should of manned up from the get go!
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Great post SFP! Completely agree!
 
SFP said:
What bugged me about his confession is that he wanted to pass blame around to everyone instead of really being a man and saying what he did was wrong regardless of anyone or the climate of the game. Now that would have taken courage! He knew what he was doing at the time was wrong and so he should of manned up from the get go!
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And the fact that he said it didn't help him hit home runs, he must think baseball fans are stupid!

And those fake crocodile tears...lol
 
Murph said:
And the fact that he said it didn't help him hit home runs, he must think baseball fans are stupid!

And those fake crocodile tears...lol
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The guy is classless, plain and simple. The thing that people aren't mentioning though is that this guy would be a borderline hall of famer without the steroid controversy. Baseball-reference has him as most similar throughout his career to Cecil Fielder. Not exactly HOF material.

His apology was half-assed for sure. Passthe blame, say it didn't help, etc. What a jerkoff. Of course it helped you. It didn't enhance his performance? Then he says it helped him return from injury more quickly? That is an increase in performance, I'd say.
 
Bradleyguy10 said:
For the most part though I think it has been digging into his conscious for a long long time and he's wanted to get it off his chest. That's the true sign of him caring that he did it in the first place rather than caring he got "caught". JMO
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I am curious if his "conscious" bothered him at all when he was cashing all those big time pay checks, right in the middle of cheating? BTW he pretty much cheated his entire career. I have a feeling without cheating MM would have been a has been long before he became a * in MLB.

He along with his entire sport is nothing but a bunch of lieing cheating jerks. Point fingers at everyone else, lie lie lie, then blame others if you get caught. Terrible people involved in baseball.

Every single person who played during the "steroid era" is a guilty lieing person and not one deserves any applause or concern. They all got very rich off of cheating the public.
 
And for the most part I agree with you. I can't say you are wrong to anything you said except the "jerk" part. I don't think he's a jerk. I think he's a good guy that did something very bad and we can't change it now so what's the point of it. If those cardinals hitters end up being more consistent or all improve this season I'm going to applaud him and I won't have a grudge. And I won't make the already-old joke about him telling them all to take steroids and that's why they are hitting better.
 
Bradleyguy10 said:
And for the most part I agree with you. I can't say you are wrong to anything you said except the "jerk" part. I don't think he's a jerk. I think he's a good guy that did something very bad and we can't change it now so what's the point of it. If those cardinals hitters end up being more consistent or all improve this season I'm going to applaud him and I won't have a grudge. And I won't make the already-old joke about him telling them all to take steroids and that's why they are hitting better.
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Oh Im not saying he is just a jerk, every single player who played in this era is a jerk for lieing continually to us about steriods and how none of them had any idea this was going on and refused to demand this sport be cleaned up. Now those same ones who say oh there was no problem, now want to blame everyone but themselves for what is now proven a huge all out lie to fraud the public.

Players, front offices, coaches, managers, trainers, MLB, agents all lieing jerks. And I will say this, I played HS baseball graduating in 88 and college baseball graduating in 92 and played with and against many guys who played in that era... they are all included in my assessment.

They all stole the publics money. There may be nothing that can be done now about all the lieing and cheating but I sure can stop giving my money to them now. I might be only one person but as far as Baseball is concerned no more giving them money for tickets.

They told all of us there was no steriod problem, they all lied bigtime.
 
houstontxbrave said:
Every single person who played during the "steroid era" is a guilty lieing person and not one deserves any applause or concern. They all got very rich off of cheating the public.
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Wrong. Every single person who took steroids, ped's, human growth hormones, or anything else during any era is an a$$. They are the ones who deserve nothing. Not every player is guilty. There were hundreds of players who did not cheat. Thome, Girardi, Shouse, are in that group. Yes many did cheat and they deserve all the same scorn that is directed at McGwire. I would like to see that list of 100+ players that failed the test.

All these excuses as to why are total bs. Injuries, no testing, not illegal, it didn't help, I was already good, etc makes me puke. I can't believe he feels that way. He is still in denial. He releases a short press release just prior to coming to STL for a Winter event and then meets with the press for 6 minutes in a hallway before its canceled and he walks away. It does not address the issue or answer all the questions. Now he says lets move on, that its all in the past, that he has already addressed it..... unbelievable.

If he wants credit for admitting it, give it to him. If he says that he feels better and that a big burden has been lifted, he is probably right. If he wants to be a hitting instructor then he better be the most qualified and he better be good. Players better not do what McGwire did to get good.

Just DO NOT expect dads to speak highly of him to their kids. DO NOT except fans forget. DO NOT expect clean players and ex players from any era to ever give you respect. DO NOT expect to get into the Hall of Fame. These are the consequences you get when you lose all morals and values at the expense of others.

And will somebody please tell LaRussa to shut up. All he is trying to do is take some of the heat and deflect any attention away from McGwire. It does not make him look very good.
 
BuB said:
And will somebody please tell LaRussa to shut up. All he is trying to do is take some of the heat and deflect any attention away from McGwire. It does not make him look very good.
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Last week Jay Mariotti he would never vote LaRussa to the HOF because he knew what was going on both in Oakland and St Louis.
 
BuB said:
Wrong. Every single person who took steroids, ped's, human growth hormones, or anything else during any era is an a$$. ....
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that would leave only Jim Thome, Frank Thomas, and Greg Maddux....and maybe Ozzie Guillen
 
BuB said:
Thome, Girardi, Shouse, are in that group. QUOTE]

Why because they said so? Just because someone isnt failing a drug test does not mean they are not guilty if for anything other then by association. That ist of 100 names. What happens if someone is on it, that you dont expect to be on it? Then what more excuses?

You dont think any of those 3 didnt have any knowledge of what was going on in the sport? Didnt even the non-user have a respondsibilty to speak up and to clean up the sport? Or was it more important to the non user to stay quiet and keep cashing tainted pay checks.

Just because a guy is a good guy and is local, doesnt mean he could have never been involved in something to help inhance his abilities. Thome's before and after pictures are startling.

I am not wrong since it is completely my opinion. But I stick by they are all guilty and lieing jerks.
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tornado said:
that would leave only Jim Thome, Frank Thomas, and Greg Maddux....and maybe Ozzie Guillen
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Let's not leave off Cal Ripken! The game would have survived without McGwire and Sosa IMO but we would not be paying the price we have to pay now to see a game. I only now go to game when I get free tickets. I use to buy season weekend ticket plans but the prices for decent seats have gotten way out of hand.
 
houstontxbrave said:
BuB said:
Thome, Girardi, Shouse, are in that group. QUOTE]

Why because they said so? Just because someone isnt failing a drug test does not mean they are not guilty if for anything other then by association. That ist of 100 names. What happens if someone is on it, that you dont expect to be on it? Then what more excuses?

You dont think any of those 3 didnt have any knowledge of what was going on in the sport? Didnt even the non-user have a respondsibilty to speak up and to clean up the sport? Or was it more important to the non user to stay quiet and keep cashing tainted pay checks.

Just because a guy is a good guy and is local, doesnt mean he could have never been involved in something to help inhance his abilities. Thome's before and after pictures are startling.

I am not wrong since it is completely my opinion. But I stick by they are all guilty and lieing jerks.
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That is the biggest way to prove you have not cheated. Pass every test. You assume that these guys talk about cheating freely in the locker rooms and have open discussions. Whoever makes that decision to cheat will only speak to others with the same character, again, players with no morals or values. If you don't want to get caught you don't talk freely. (McGwire)

That argument is like saying all NBA guys are jerks because of Arenas or Artest and all NFL guys are jerks because of Vick or Plaxico. Union workers are not all jerks and guilty because some of them fail a test or get caught doing something illegal. These *****s are not broadcasting their intentions to everyone.

A non user is not cashing a tainted check. He is the only one earning it the right way. If anything they are losing money because some *****s have success at their expense.

Its funny you mention Thome's size. If you knew the family you would know that he is one of the smallest. :-o Very likely he was going to get bigger.
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