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Big Mac admits to steroids

Hombres, Tornado is just arguing that there is no crime "under the influence of steroids". And too my knowledge he is correct. For instance, being heavily intoxicated in public even when not holding any alcohol is a crime, generally. But walking around 'under the influence' of steroids is not a crime. Sure, obtaining them illegally, and having them in your coat pocket is a crime, but having the junk in your veins isn't actually a crime. This is also true for most drugs. However, some states have put in place tricky laws to attack a lot of opiates, for instance, operating heavy machinery or an automobile while under the influence of an opiate is illegal. On that note, driving while on steroids is not. There are a whole host of laws that could affect him in certain situations thou: for instance, if he ever transported steroids, especially across state lines, or if he paid for them, and if he did, he more than likely didn't pay taxes on the illegally acquired steroids, etc etc. The fact is, the crimes aren't worth the effort to convict really, and it would be difficult to prove anyway.

What is abundantly clear if that he broke baseball law, and that is about it. There might be some possibility to arguing a civil matter due to contract infringement but i doubt it and it would depend a lot on exactly what it is they sign when they enter the major league.

At the end of the day, a guy just wanted to feel normal..... so he took horse steroids.
 
CzechBrave said:
What is abundantly clear if that he broke baseball law,....
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look, I know this is already a near-dead horse...but....

Mark McGwire retired and was completely done playing before major league baseball ever had a rule against anything he appears to have done...

In other words...no, he did not break any baseball rules, and even if some believe he broke the spirit of some yet-to-be-written rule, what is "baseball" going to do?
Remove his records? It might happen, but where do you draw the line...do you also remove the records of everyone else who is suspect....that could literally lead to the removal of almost all the baseball records over the past 2 decades...

beating_a_dead_horse.jpg



CzechBrave said:
This board is brutal. Between this, and.....
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let's see, a disagreement over steroids, and a poll that got sabotaged by someone whose agenda was to make the site look bad...yup - those are a couple of huge landmark issues...
maybe some take discussion boards a bit too seriously...move away from the ledge....
 
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I do not blame McGuire, Bonds, Sosa, A-Rod, or any of the others who used or may have used steroids. I blame The Commissioner and the owners. These guys knew what was going on and they looked the other way..... and as a result they ruined the game of baseball and the integrity of the record book.
 
Braves4Life said:
I do not blame McGuire, Bonds, Sosa, A-Rod, or any of the others who used or may have used steroids. I blame The Commissioner and the owners. These guys knew what was going on and they looked the other way..... and as a result they ruined the game of baseball and the integrity of the record book.
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But imo, baseball has always had a culture of cheating to get an edge over someone. Gaylord Perry with the spitball. etc etc I read an entry in the Bill James historical abstract about the Hillerich and Bradsby Company tour around the major league cities in the early1980's that showcased game- used bats from different players. When the tour was in Seattle, a couple of Mariner players discovered that the Babe Ruth bat was corked! I understand that steroids are a more serious concern than corked bats and spitballs, but the culture of owners etc looking the other way has existed in baseball for quite some time.
 
tornado said:
Mark McGwire retired and was completely done playing before major league baseball ever had a rule against anything he appears to have done...

QUOTE]

I hear this repeated again and again, but it is simply not true. MLB was not testing for steroids or doing much if anything to enforce the rule against them, but they were banned when McGwire was using them. See below for documentation.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1151761/index.htm

There is also very little doubt that he broke the law by buying and/or possessing steroids without a perscription, whether or not the actual ingestion of them was illegal.

I was a big McGwire fan; I drove 6 hours and paid $100 a piece (at a time when that was a lot of money for me) for bleacher seats in order to be on hand when he hit #61, but I lost a ton of respect for him after his congressional testimony. I'm glad he finally came clean, but let's not pretend he didn't cheat.
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Well there ya go. I have limited knowledge of baseball policies, to be honest I had never really payed the sport any mind till the home run race, things are funny that way.

And I agree, he undoubtedly broke the law somewhere, And I think that a lot of people would agree with that. But breaking the law and getting convicted of breaking the law are two different animals.

i'm not aiming this at you by any means - at this point I'd suggest we use the tax dollars for something useful as opposed to indicting Mcgwire, or investigating the BCS, hah.
 
DeltaBrave03 said:
Couldn't agree more they saved baseball period. No matter how much they're hurting it now, if it hadn't been for '98 very few would even care that baseball was still around.
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Disagree! Baseball in the long run would have survived and perhaps it would still be at a price point that the average citizen could afford to take their families to a game. Could it have sustained some economic difficulty? Yes, but die, No. What sport would have taken it over? Hockey? Soccer? Golf?

BradleyJD said:
Is this appropriate for this board?

Come on Tornado.
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This is one area where T has a ton of credibility and I believe he was just taking up for his position which IMO was extremely informative. I understand how T can get under your skin but refrain from attacking for the sake of attacking.

Braves4Life said:
I do not blame McGuire, Bonds, Sosa, A-Rod, or any of the others who used or may have used steroids. I blame The Commissioner and the owners. These guys knew what was going on and they looked the other way..... and as a result they ruined the game of baseball and the integrity of the record book.
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B4L I blame them all. These are grown men and they need to take responsibility for their actions. They knew what they were doing was wrong! If they thought they were not doing anything wrong, then why hide it at the time and in public testimonies. I'm not buying into their ignorance as a means to escape from public condemnation. On the other hand I really do not care about this issue as much as other issues that are really harming our society. This is just another example of grown men being greedy in our society regardless of consequences for anyone except their selfish being. Should they get a sniff of being HOFers? I believe each one should get a chance just like any other player but if Robbie Alomar did not get in for spitting then these guys should stay out for doping.
 
Murph said:
I took my sons to the game when he broke the record. Thought we witnessed history and have had that taken away from us. My wife and I went to a game 3 years ago and when Bonds came to bat, the Cardinal fans booed profusely. Will those fans do the same when Mac walks onto the field or will they stand and cheer him?
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I went to the game he tied the record...pretty neat no matter what though. Also I went to the first home game of Matt Holliday as a cardinal this last season. You can connect the dots if you remember which team we played....


The Dodgers. Talk about feeling ashamed of the cardinal faithful when we let Manny Ramirez hear it. I dislike the guy as much as the next but booing him for steroids when most still idolized McGwire was a little childish IMO. Let alone having a closer, an outfielder, an injured but still on the roster 3rd basemen, and a first basemen that some would swear their life on has taken roids. The cardinals organization is one of the most tainted franchises when it comes to the steroid era and we have the nerve to boo Ramirez. Needless to say I did not boo. He's an ***** for taking them as recently as he did with all the testing but dang.

I just read this thread for the first time today. It's pretty funny actually. I want to assure you Tornado that I do not have multiple accounts that I use where I can go against your every word. :lol:

It's not me this time!!
 
SFP said:
B4L I blame them all. These are grown men and they need to take responsibility for their actions. They knew what they were doing was wrong! If they thought they were not doing anything wrong, then why hide it at the time and in public testimonies. I'm not buying into their ignorance as a means to escape from public condemnation. On the other hand I really do not care about this issue as much as other issues that are really harming our society. This is just another example of grown men being greedy in our society regardless of consequences for anyone except their selfish being. Should they get a sniff of being HOFers? I believe each one should get a chance just like any other player but if Robbie Alomar did not get in for spitting then these guys should stay out for doping.
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I blame them all as well SFP. I think that some players are getting off the hook though. Look at ARod. He admitted to using steroids, yet it seems to me that he is getting off the hook on this as he is chasing the career home run record. My personal opinion is that if a player is found to have used steroids, then the only way that player could get into the HOF is through the Veterans Committee. This way, that player has a chance to at least redeem himself in some meaningful way and do something beneficial to the game. However, I am not saying that the Veterans Committee should automatically elect these players.

Roberto Alomar gets into the HOF next year. Book it! :)
 
tornado said:
even with spit-gate??
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sure.. Alomar reconciled everything with the umpire. People make mistakes and at least Alomar atoned for his. I have argued that Alomar is not a first ballot HOF'er, but he does belong. Ty Cobb did much worse back in the day!
 
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