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A couple easy trivia questions

tornado

tornado

New member
WARNING and DISCLAIMER...the facts set out herein are thoroughly
researched and confirmed to be 100% accurate. If true, factual information
is disturbing to your health, or if you are simply going to be driven to argue because you cannot understand,
then please look away from the screen or do NOT mouse over to view the answers.
Do so at your own risk.



Here are the answers...mouse over to see--
Trivia Questions....
1- which of these teams (MVC, Pac-10, Big East, ACC, A-10, and Big 10)
drew MORE fans to home games over the past two seasons combined?
(and an extra star for anyone who can rank them in the precise order of their total attendances for 2007-2008 and 2008-2009 combined):
Duke, Wichita State, Notre Dame, Michigan, Clemson, Villanova, Washington, Saint Louis, Illinois State, SIU, and Bradley...

2-Name the five (or as many of the worst five) NCAA D-I schools with the worst home attendance average in 2008-2009?




1-
Bradley 346,373
Wichita State 338,879
Washington 335,103
Notre Dame 335,040
Michigan 330,168
Villanova 307,446
Duke 307,362
Clemson 273,358
Saint Louis 271,048
ISU 224,063
SIU 189,040

2- Take heart ISU and SIU fans..there are guys who are even worse!
Texas Pan American 563
Fairleigh-Dickinson 533
St Francis (NY) 477
New Jersey Institute of Technology 442
Colgate 406
 
Thats really neat. We all know it was clearly helped by our postseason games and having those additional games... but nonetheless we have all seen how great our attendance has been lately and thats a cool way to look at it.

Where did you pull those stats, T? I'd be curious to look through that!
 
WARNING and DISCLAIMER...the facts set out herein are thoroughly
researched and confirmed to be 100% accurate. If true, factual information
is disturbing to your health, or if you are simply going to be driven to argue because you cannot understand,
then please look away from the screen or do NOT view the answers.
Do so at your own risk.

I love my school, don't tell me otherwise. Standing front row of the student section for the last 4 years will do that to a guy. But I'm also a stats person, and I want to look at this a little differently to give what I think is a better perspective:

Yes, we drew the most people total, but that's probably due in large part us having the second largest arena in capacity (Michigan is #1), and playing the second most total number of home games (Washington was #1) than any of the other schools on this list. I think a more reasonable way of looking at this was avg. attendance, and also capacity %

So here we go:

AVERAGE ATTENDANCE

School / Total Attendance: / # of Games: / Avg. Attendance: / % of Capacity Filled
Michigan 330,168/32/10,318/ 75% (of 13,751)
Wichita St. 338,879/33/10,270/ 97.7% (of 10,502)
Villanova 307,446/32/9,608/ (tough to tell because they play at 2 separate venues)
Notre Dame 335,040/35/9,573/ 83.8% (of 11,418 )
Bradley 346,373/37/9,362/ 81.8% (of 11,442) -6th
Duke 307,362/33/9,314/ 100% (of 9,314) -best
Washington 335,103/38/8,819/ 88.2% (of 10,000)
Clemson 273,358/32/8,543/ 82.7% (of 10,325)
St. Louis 271,048/33/8,214/ 77.5% (of 10,600)
isu 224,063/33/6,789/ 66.6% (of 10,200)
SIU 189040/30/6,302/ 65.5% (of 9,628 ) -worst
 
That Guy said:
WARNING and DISCLAIMER...the facts set out herein are thoroughly
researched and confirmed to be 100% accurate. If true, factual information
is disturbing to your health, or if you are simply going to be driven to argue because you cannot understand,
then please look away from the screen or do NOT view the answers.
Do so at your own risk.

I love my school, don't tell me otherwise. Standing front row of the student section for the last 4 years will do that to a guy. But I'm also a stats person, and I want to look at this a little differently to give what I think is a better perspective:

Yes, we drew the most people total, but that's probably due in large part us having the second largest arena in capacity (Michigan is #1), and playing the second most total number of home games (Washington was #1) than any of the other schools on this list. I think a more reasonable way of looking at this was avg. attendance, and also capacity %

So here we go:

AVERAGE ATTENDANCE

School / Total Attendance: / # of Games: / Avg. Attendance: / % of Capacity Filled
Michigan 330,168/32/10,318/ 75% (of 13,751)
Wichita St. 338,879/33/10,270/ 97.7% (of 10,502)
Villanova 307,446/32/9,608/ (tough to tell because they play at 2 separate venues)
Notre Dame 335,040/35/9,573/ 83.8% (of 11,418 )
Bradley 346,373/37/9,362/ 81.8% (of 11,442) -6th
Duke 307,362/33/9,314/ 100% (of 9,314) -best
Washington 335,103/38/8,819/ 88.2% (of 10,000)
Clemson 273,358/32/8,543/ 82.7% (of 10,325)
St. Louis 271,048/33/8,214/ 77.5% (of 10,600)
isu 224,063/33/6,789/ 66.6% (of 10,200)
SIU 189040/30/6,302/ 65.5% (of 9,628 ) -worst
Click to expand...


NAYSAYER!!! HOW DARE YOU USE LOGIC!!:roll:

But in all honesty that is pretty cool we beat Duke etc. And even if we do have the 2nd largest arena on the list...we're still filling it up.
 
but most BCS schools routinely host 18, 19, 20 home games per season because of all the guarantee games they buy...something that is far more difficult for mid-majors to do.
 
tornado said:
but most BCS schools routinely host 18, 19, 20 home games per season because of all the guarantee games they buy...something that is far more difficult for mid-majors to do.
Click to expand...

If you look, I have factored the total number of home games in those numbers. Bradley has the second highest number of home games played (37), behind only Washington...
 
Just curious, is there someplace that lists the official arena capacities for Valley basketball teams? I ask because I've seen a few different numbers for Carver Arena....

11,060
11,164
11,433
11,442
 
That Guy said:
I think a more reasonable way of looking at this was avg. attendance, and also capacity %
Click to expand...

Bradleyguy10 said:
NAYSAYER!!! HOW DARE YOU USE LOGIC!!:roll:
Click to expand...

This is what I was waiting for. I knew when I read T's first post, it would be shown by someone how other arenas are bigger, some have more home games, etc. And that's fine. That puts things into perspective.

But once again... T merely stated FACTS. That's it. Just like in the Recruiting Guide - they are FACTS.

I'm smart enough to know the numbers don't show the whole story. And I am smart enough to know the facts are FACTS.

But we have some who can't stand seeing FACTS without putting them into perspective that downplays the FACTS. And like I said - that's fine. And like I said - I am smart enough to know the perspectives needed to understand the FACTS don't tell the whole story.

But what I take exception to is... there are a couple people I know who can't stand the FACTS stated without the perspective... and wonder why they don't challenge the Recruiting Guide's statements of facts. Suppose it's ok with them since they like the guy making the statement of facts in the Recruiting Guide as opposed to Tornado making any kind of statement of facts.

BradleyGuy10 - I don't know you and don't recall you being one of those I am referring to who has a problem with T. Those I am referring to know who they are.
 
That Guy said:
WARNING and DISCLAIMER...the facts set out herein are thoroughly
researched and confirmed to be 100% accurate. If true, factual information
is disturbing to your health, or if you are simply going to be driven to argue because you cannot understand,
then please look away from the screen or do NOT view the answers.
Do so at your own risk.

I love my school, don't tell me otherwise. Standing front row of the student section for the last 4 years will do that to a guy. But I'm also a stats person, and I want to look at this a little differently to give what I think is a better perspective:

Yes, we drew the most people total, but that's probably due in large part us having the second largest arena in capacity (Michigan is #1), and playing the second most total number of home games (Washington was #1) than any of the other schools on this list. I think a more reasonable way of looking at this was avg. attendance, and also capacity %

So here we go:

AVERAGE ATTENDANCE

School / Total Attendance: / # of Games: / Avg. Attendance: / % of Capacity Filled
Michigan 330,168/32/10,318/ 75% (of 13,751)
Wichita St. 338,879/33/10,270/ 97.7% (of 10,502)
Villanova 307,446/32/9,608/ (tough to tell because they play at 2 separate venues)
Notre Dame 335,040/35/9,573/ 83.8% (of 11,418 )
Bradley 346,373/37/9,362/ 81.8% (of 11,442) -6th
Duke 307,362/33/9,314/ 100% (of 9,314) -best
Washington 335,103/38/8,819/ 88.2% (of 10,000)
Clemson 273,358/32/8,543/ 82.7% (of 10,325)
St. Louis 271,048/33/8,214/ 77.5% (of 10,600)
isu 224,063/33/6,789/ 66.6% (of 10,200)
SIU 189040/30/6,302/ 65.5% (of 9,628 ) -worst
Click to expand...

Why is size of the arena/capacity relevant? Outside of Duke, where capacity is an issue because every game is a sellout, what difference does that make? I can understand the average attendance being another way to look at it (although I certainly do not mind total ticket sales either), but can not understand capacity and why it would be more impressive if the Braves played in a smaller arena.
 
BU Firsty said:
Why is size of the arena/capacity relevant?
Click to expand...


I included that average attendance, as well as the percentage of capacity because they are also two different ways to look at attendance. Yes, Duke is 7th in total attendance, and 6th in average attendance, but that is largely due to the fact that their arena holds less than 9,500 people. Duke would easily sell out an arena Bradley's size on a nightly basis. My point is, just because we have the most people through the gates, doesn't mean our games are the best "attended" out of this group.
 
That Guy said:
So how does adding more FACTS to the FACTS already given downplay anything? I'd rather have as much information about something, and then be left to make my own decisions than be spoonfed only certain facts that may or may not tell the entire story. I don't see this as a bad thing. Nothing T has said is factually incorrect, nor for that matter is this set of additional information.
Click to expand...

First of all - Understand... I do agree with you.

But I believe there is more "history" behind all of this. Maybe this pre-dates you in the cyberworld/Bradleyfans.com/messageboard-world.

I understand T's message and agenda in his "disclaimer" and what he says and how he says it. For those he aims at, they might get it - for others, they likely don't get it and are innocent bystanders. And then the argument ensues.

T is making a statement of a fact. It is what it is. And it enflames anti-Bradley folk and fuels the anti-Tornado folk.

I personally laugh at it all and can't wait for Tornado to post another fact to tick off those that don't like him, don't like what he says, and don't like how he says it.

Cause I am...

a Schadenfreude.

LOL! :lol:
 
That Guy said:
Yes, Duke is 7th in total attendance, and 6th in average attendance, but that is largely due to the fact that their arena holds less than 9,500 people. Duke would easily sell out an arena Bradley's size on a nightly basis. My point is, just because we have the most people through the gates, doesn't mean our games are the best "attended" out of this group.
Click to expand...

I was surprised to see Duke's capacity was so low, but I guess Cameron Indoor Stadium has a lot of tradition and they figure the home court advantage would not be as strong if they built a newer facility. There have been times in the last twenty-five years when I have thought it would have been fine if Bradley had just stayed in the Field House, but then I also know I would have been a little annoyed at all the times I would not have gotten tickets.
 
That Guy said:
If you look, I have factored the total number of home games in those numbers. Bradley has the second highest number of home games played (37), behind only Washington...
Click to expand...

Bradley's number of home games includes the large number of extra home games they have gotten from the CBI and CIT the last 2 years. They did not schedule those games.
I am pointing that out, because it clearly is a different situation to those schools that schedule excessive home games just to pile up preconference wins, and sell them as part of the season ticket package. Such excessive home-game scheduling, and including them in a season -ticket package will inflate that team's home attendance.
 
Da Coach said:
Bradley's number of home games includes the large number of extra home games they have gotten from the CBI and CIT the last 2 years. They did not schedule those games.
I am pointing that out, because it clearly is a different situation to those schools that schedule excessive home games just to pile up preconference wins, and sell them as part of the season ticket package. Such excessive home-game scheduling, and including them in a season -ticket package will inflate that team's home attendance.
Click to expand...

Which is exactly why average attendance and the percent of capacity that they fill their arena can be a more telling stat than overall total attendance. Without those extra home games, Bradley would be in the middle of the pack of these teams in terms of total attendance. And actually, our average attendance numbers and % of capacity numbers would actually rise.

Also, why were some of our posts deleted on this thread?
 
I would disagree, and I am speaking off the top of my head (no research).

Postseason tourney games like CBI, NIT, etc. have a much lower attendance percentage, because of the handling of the tickets over the course of like 2 days. My guess is our average, and percent of capacity would improve without those games factored in.
 
There is no question that attendance will be higher if a game is part of the season-ticket package.
BCS schools know this, and that's partly why they schedule extra, easily winnable games early. They know that season-ticket buyers will gladly pony up for the early games (even if many are actually no-shows when the game is played) just to get tickets for the conference games, and better non-conference games in the package.
The only criticism I would have is against power conference schools that schedule a lot of easy home wins early, because they know that when they get into conference play, their RPI will rise enough to be considered for at-large bids. IMO, the NCAA should look at non-conference RPI separately when they consider their at-large bids.

The CIT and CBI games did amazingly well for games that were not scheduled until a matter of a couple days before they were to be played. Bradley had the highest attendance of any CBI or CIT host. But only a couple of the games approached the attendance of the regular season games.
 
BU regular season home average attendance was better last year (and the year before) than the numbers indicate, because the final stat is lowered by the extra games in the post season...
It's really great that we got those extra games and I know nobody would want it otherwise, but they do lower the per-game attendance stats.
But if you point to the lowered average attendance because of the post-season games it's like taking a baseball player who had two walks,
two sac flies, and a sac bunt with 3 RBI's, and ragging about how the guy didn't get a hit that day!

so if there are people who discount the total attendance figures because of the extra games, then let's GO BACK to what BU's average attendance is without them..

2007-2008: average attendance goes from 9600 to 10115
2008-2009: average attendance goes from 9110 to 10019
that suddenly pushes BU's home attendance almost into the Top 40 among all 1000 NCAA schools!

but why can't people just accept that Bradley draws very, very well, and why find some bizarre and ridiculous stat to try to claim otherwise?

I have given the figures and the links where you can look it all up yourself.
Remember- there are about 270 non-BCS programs.....and among those 270, Bradley ranks inside the TOP TEN in home attendance - PERIOD.
Among midmajor schools who do NOT have football to draw in extra income to help the program, then BU ranks 5th!!
FIFTH in the entire nation...that's a compliment to the program, the epople, and the fans..........and I am proud the be a Bradley fan, and won't back down from those who want to squelch the enthusiasm.
 
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