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DePaul Head Coach Jerry Wainwright - Hot Seat?

DePaul will never be able to compete consistently in the Big East. Their best hope is the much speculated blow-up of the Big East, where DePaul can enter into a conference of more like minded schools (perhaps even the all-Catholic school conference that also been bandied about).
 
DePaul already does well on the women's side in the Big East.

IMO, DePaul can be successful in the Big East by not being too successful.

To their credit, they have traditionally scheduled competitive non-cons, but all they need to do is beef up on cupcakes and finish near .500 in BE play to have a "successful" year, even though it's not overly successful in conference play. Doing so puts them in the postseason every year.

And the further problem with Wainwright is his teams are notorious slow starters that struggle early in the year, but at the end of the season can handle anyone. It's a sort of trademark.

They don't need to make the NCAA to be successful in the Big East as it is now.

But if they get a coach that can figure that out AND have success in conference, then they're back rather quickly.
 
do you still think present LaSalle head coach John Giannini is in line to get the head coaching spot at DePaul if Wainwright gets canned?
Seems to me DePaul would aim higher than to go after another middle-of-the-pack A-10 guy?
 
That's a good question tornado. . .

I think a lot will depend on the Explorers success this upcoming season. I expect LaSalle to be an NCAA Tournament team.

I think he and Mihalich from Niagara, if they apply would be the best "fit" for DePaul's situation (tradition rich programs at Catholic schools who experienced decades of struggles). Particularly at LaSalle, Giannini has done it with limited resources on hand in a bigger conference.

If I were AD at DePaul, those are the first two guys I'm calling.

That doesn't mean there won't be others in the running. But I think DePaul would be hard-pressed to find a better fit than either of those two. . .
 
If DePaul wants to win, hire Tim Floyd
if they want to win ethically, hire Brad Stevens, Dana Altman, or Jim Molinari
 
I wonder if this will be used as a recruiting angle by opposing coaches who are going head-to-head with Wainwright for the same kids?

nah........coaches would never do a thing like that........
 
Giannini's 5 years at LaSalle look good only because the 12 years prior to his arriving were abysmal. They hadn't had a winning season in that long, and haven't made an NCAA tounament since 1992.
However, Giannini's record in his 5 seasons has been that great:
Year..............Record.......Conference........RPI
2004-2005......10-19...........5-11.............214
2005-2006......18-10...........10-6.............103
2006-2007......10-20...........3-13.............268
2007-2008......15-17............8-8..............163
2008-2009......18-13............9-7..............112

You have been one of Jim Les' biggest critics, yet Giannini has not come close to 20 wins, has never made the NCAA or any postseason tournament, and he has never finished with an RPI under triple digits. Bradley doesn't have any advantages that LaSalle doesn't have, and LaSalle is in one of the recruiting hotbeds of the country. You have said Jim Les needs another NCAA run this year or he should be fired, and yet you promote Giannini as a highly successful coach that deserves consideration for the Depaul job despite the fact that Jim Les' record looks awesome compared to Giannini's. Why the difference?

LaSalle returns something like their top 7 scorers from last year's team, so Giannini should have a better year this year. But until he wins 20+ games, and until he at least breaks 100 in the RPI or beats someone in a postseason tournament, I can't see Giannini getting any offers.
 
squirrelgotdead said:
I think a lot will depend on the Explorers success this upcoming season. I expect LaSalle to be an NCAA Tournament team.

I think he and Mihalich from Niagara, if they apply would be the best "fit" for DePaul's situation (tradition rich programs at Catholic schools who experienced decades of struggles). Particularly at LaSalle, Giannini has done it with limited resources on hand in a bigger conference.

If I were AD at DePaul, those are the first two guys I'm calling.

That doesn't mean there won't be others in the running. But I think DePaul would be hard-pressed to find a better fit than either of those two. . .
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But sgd,
LaSalle hasn't made the NCAA since 1992-
.. they have had a winning record only twice in the last 16+ years,
and even then they won 18 games those 2 years and finished with their best RPIs of 103 and 112.
They have never come close to winning 20 games, or finishing in the top 100 RPI in nearly a couple decades.

If Bradley had a track record like this, the coach's head would be on the chopping block or he would have already been long, long gone,
and he sure wouldn't be getting mentioned as a top candidate for a Big East job, would he?
 
tornado said:
But sgd,
LaSalle hasn't made the NCAA since 1992-
.. they have had a winning record only twice in the last 16+ years,
and even then they won 18 games those 2 years and finished with their best RPIs of 103 and 112.
They have never come close to winning 20 games, or finishing in the top 100 RPI in nearly a couple decades.

If Bradley had a track record like this, the coach's head would be on the chopping block or he would have already been long, long gone,
and he sure wouldn't be getting mentioned as a top candidate for a Big East job, would he?
Click to expand...


You guys are both making my arguments for me.

LaSalle has had only two winning seasons in the last 16 years. Guess who got them there with a program that was a trainwreck when it was inherited?

In 2008, despite the 15-17 overall, the Explorers entered the final week of the season in 2nd place, but the incredibly young upstart team had to play three upper division league foes in URI, UMass, and Temple, losing all three, and dropping to 7th.

(I'll concede they benefited from a scheduling scheme in the A10 that was addressed last year).

And Da Coach, you say that Bradley doesn't have any recruiting advantages that LaSalle doesn't, and that's not quite correct. Bradley spends nearly $1 million more on men's basketball, has superior facilities, and administrative support. LaSalle University only marginally supports athletics, and is quite inactive in so doing. While they have the Philly market right there, they are a small fish in a big pond.

If JL can't get the DJ Richardson's to stay home, then LaSalle is in no different position.

Also, if you talk to active DI coaches, they would all cite Giannini of being one of the best motivators and offensive minds in the profession right now.

Nearly every single DI coach (head and assistant) has read his book "Court Sense" which was released within the last couple years.

And I'd be willing to bet JL has taken parts of Giannini's DDM philosophy and applied it to his team here at BU.

Giannini also had a 24 and 20 win season (back when those numbers really meant something) at Maine, who is traditionally one of the weakest America East programs.
 
squirrelgotdead said:
DePaul already does well on the women's side in the Big East.

IMO, DePaul can be successful in the Big East by not being too successful.

To their credit, they have traditionally scheduled competitive non-cons, but all they need to do is beef up on cupcakes and finish near .500 in BE play to have a "successful" year, even though it's not overly successful in conference play. Doing so puts them in the postseason every year.

And the further problem with Wainwright is his teams are notorious slow starters that struggle early in the year, but at the end of the season can handle anyone. It's a sort of trademark.

They don't need to make the NCAA to be successful in the Big East as it is now.

But if they get a coach that can figure that out AND have success in conference, then they're back rather quickly.
Click to expand...

I don't follow women's hoops, so I'll concede that point. Unfortunately, Men's hoops pays the bills.

I just think that DePaul lacks the financial wherewithall to compete with the Big East powers. On top of that, the conference is a bad fit for them on geographic grounds. Chicago is midwestern, not eastern. As a result, Depaul regularly has greater travel expenses and longer trips than most of its conference peers. Furthermore, it has very little in common with most of the other schools in its conference.
 
squirrelgotdead said:
And Da Coach, you say that Bradley doesn't have any recruiting advantages that LaSalle doesn't, and that's not quite correct. Bradley spends nearly $1 million more on men's basketball, has superior facilities, and administrative support. LaSalle University only marginally supports athletics, and is quite inactive in so doing. While they have the Philly market right there, they are a small fish in a big pond.

If JL can't get the DJ Richardson's to stay home, then LaSalle is in no different position.
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I like Giannini and respect him as a coach. But he is not going to get higher offers based on the record he's had at LaSalle so far. 2 winning seasons out of 5 (and the first one was with the players he inherited), will not impress anyone.

As far as facilities- Only now with the improvements made on Bradley's campus this past year are Bradley's facilities anywhere close to LaSalle's. They built the state-of-the-art Hayman Center in 1998 that has athletic facilities that would put what Bradley has had to shame.
And as far as athletic budgets go, everywhere I checked, the numbers are very close between Bradley and LaSalle. Both are non-football schools.
Their recruiting costs may be less, only because so many of their recruits are right in their back yard. And they play in their own arena, so that saves them several hundred thousand dollars a year in facility rental.
I just can't buy your reasoning that somehow Bradley has so many innate advantages that it should be easier for Bradley to win. I think LaSalle has the advantage by being in the A10 and in a large city like Philly.
Note that LaSalle is ranked #212 and Bradley #215 in athletic revenues in D1, and the top sport at both schools is men's basketball.
http://www.bbstate.com/info/schools-revenue

Also, LaSalle plays in the Atlantic 10, and lies in one of the largest media and population markets in the country. Those are huge advantages over Bradley/the MVC/and Peoria. Peoria may have 1 or 2 D1 players per year, while the Philly area has many.
 
Understood. And with a decent team, anybody who can offer a home slate with Georgetown, Louisville, Syracuse, Connecticut, Villanova, Pittsburgh etc. can rake in moolah from ticket sales.

The problem right now is fans are deliberately staying away to make a point to the administration.

But all the CUSA members are making more money in the Big East, with Cincinnati and Louisville being the biggest gainers.

So even though they have a long ways back to respectability, they won't leave unless they stand to lose money.

Syracuse is the biggest financial loser in the Big East, at an estimated loss of $2 million. That's why I think they are more likely to leave and be replaced quickly by Memphis, UCF, Charlotte, or someone similar before any implosion will occur.
 
Da Coach said:
I like Giannini and respect him as a coach. But he is not going to get higher offers based on the record he's had at LaSalle so far. 2 winning seasons out of 5 (and the first one was with the players he inherited), will not impress anyone.

As far as facilities- Only now with the improvements made on Bradley's campus this past year are Bradley's facilities anywhere close to LaSalle's. They built the state-of-the-art Hayman Center in 1998 that has athletic facilities that would put what Bradley has had to shame.
And as far as athletic budgets go, everywhere I checked, the numbers are very close between Bradley and LaSalle. Both are non-football schools.
Their recruiting costs may be less, only because so many of their recruits are right in their back yard. And they play in their own arena, so that saves them several hundred thousand dollars a year in facility rental.
I just can't buy your reasoning that somehow Bradley has so many innate advantages that it should be easier for Bradley to win. I think LaSalle has the advantage by being in the A10 and in a large city like Philly.
Note that LaSalle is ranked #212 and Bradley #215 in athletic revenues in D1, and the top sport at both schools is men's basketball.
http://www.bbstate.com/info/schools-revenue

Also, LaSalle plays in the Atlantic 10, and lies in one of the largest media and population markets in the country. Those are huge advantages over Bradley/the MVC/and Peoria. Peoria may have 1 or 2 D1 players per year, while the Philly area has many.
Click to expand...

And he only had 3 Philly area players on his team last year, and will add a 4th this year.

BU will have 4 this year. The number bumps to 5 for each if you grant a 100 mile radius, and has had typically 3-4 at any given time.

I'm not saying it doesn't offer good potential for LaSalle, but the other thing to keep in mind is 2 teams in their own conference have significantly better name recognition among preps in Philly in St. Joe's and Temple. When you are routinely third behind those schools you've got a lot of hard selling to do.

What I see in Giannini is a championship-caliber coach. Regardless of his situation.

If people really want to believe JL is a better fit at DePaul (and I actually think JL would be a very good fit for DePaul, just not the best), I'd gladly take Giannini as a consolation prize. And I think any coach would agree BU could be a step up from LaSalle, despite conference affiliation given the reasons I'm citing.

I'd even supply a glowing letter of recommendation to DePaul if JL is interested in the gig.
 
If offered, I have to believe Jim Les would be a qualified candidate for the DePaul job and he might just give it some pretty serious consideration...
 
tornado said:
If offered, I have to believe Jim Les would be a qualified candidate for the DePaul job and he might just give it some pretty serious consideration...
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I agree. I think JL has proven recruiting ability, and that will be a big factor in who they hire, IMO.

DePaul could really go one of three ways--and this has been a problem they've struggled with ever since Meyer retired.

1) The legacy hire. Joey screwed that up. Molinari might get some interest, but I think he would be perfectly content to stay and build WIU. There may be some past players that get a look as well, but ultimately I don't think DePaul will look at their relatively recent past for future glory. JMHO.

2) The recruiting hire. Someone who can lock up a market share of Chicago talent. This is a must, where I stand. Nearly every DI in-state has had reasonable success recruiting in Chicago. DePaul is probably the biggest one that has struggled (I realize they have had very good players from the area despite their struggles). That is why JL I think would have a very good shot at DePaul. However, this is the way the went with Kennedy. And it worked, except his tenure coincided with the mass exodus of early entry to the NBA.

3) The smart hire. This is the way I feel DePaul will ultimately go, with someone who is relatively strong in recruiting as well. This is the category I would tend to group Giannini and Mihalich in. And Giannini, despite what I consider recruiting disadvantages at LaSalle has done very well in, and I think he is another ideal candidate for DePaul. This is the category they went with Wainwright, and of the three it backfired the least. Wainwright has actually recruited reasonably well, but has lost a lot of talent to transfer, academics, and early entry.
 
tornado said:
If offered, I have to believe Jim Les would be a qualified candidate for the DePaul job and he might just give it some pretty serious consideration...
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Interesting T

Assuming he'd be offered the job which is a big assumption in my opinion why would Les leave BU and Peoria? He looks like a lifer to me. If they'll have him, he'd stay at BU for 20 more years. He doesn't strike me as the type to leave the nest.

Besides getting probably twice his salary if he got the DePaul job what other reason would he have to leave the safe cocoon he has at his alma mater in Peoria?? If Jim Les left BU for DePaul without being fired it would be a colossal mistake IMO. career suicide.

The money isn't a good enough reason as I'm sure Les is quite well paid in proportion to the cheap cost of living in P'Town vs. Chicago.
 
DannyCooksey said:
Besides getting probably twice his salary if he got the DePaul job what other reason would he have to leave the safe cocoon he has at his alma mater in
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What makes you think the cocoon is safe? I realize there is no reason to remove him as coach, now.

The President and AD who hired him are both gone.

At some point he needs to start delivering championships.

I would hope others agree with that. Including the new AD and President.
 
squirrelgotdead said:
What makes you think the cocoon is safe? I realize there is no reason to remove him as coach, now.

The President and AD who hired him are both gone.

At some point he needs to start delivering championships.

I would hope others agree with that. Including the new AD and President.
Click to expand...
I've always been led to believe that his job is as safe as can be. In fact I asked about the possibility of problems occuring because the AD and Pres didn't hire him and it was quickly dismissed and I was told on this board that it was a non-issue. The folks that said this are the 'experts' and the ones on this board with the most inside knowledge it would seem. Or so they claim. Look for yourself.......

http://bradleyfans.com/vb/showthread.php?t=12415
 
squirrelgotdead said:
What makes you think the cocoon is safe? I realize there is no reason to remove him as coach, now.

The President and AD who hired him are both gone.

At some point he needs to start delivering championships.

I would hope others agree with that. Including the new AD and President.
Click to expand...

Are you the Prez's PR person? Adding fire where there should not be any. Trying to create a problem where there is not one just in case. I believe most of the Alumns are quite satisfied with how JL has handled the program. Do we want more? Sure, but we are wise enough to know that it takes a bunch of small steps to go forward and JL is going in the right direction. He also is running a clean program and generating great citizens that we can be proud of. Could he take short cuts and start winning quicker? Yes, but he will not and that is why he is perfect for us.
 
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