IU Recruits Want OUT

[brebeuf1fan@iu]

brebeuf1fan,

I like Indiana, my son went there, they have a ton of my money, and many other close friends and associates are IU fans. So please don't think I am one who would ever bash IU. But I think you are too close to IU and too big a fan to be objective. I have listened for the past 4-5 months to my friends and family who are also huge IU fans as they have brushed off the NCAA investigation, the cheating charges, the Gordon recruiting fiasco, and more. I have heard how this is all a witch hunt, a minor infraction, and nothing will ever come of it. I have heard it is a vendetta by Miles Brand, a witch hunt by the infractions committee, or that it has been driven by other jealous Big Ten coaches who couldn't stand that Sampson was outrecruiting them.

In fact I haven't met an IU fan that was realistic to accept any of these events, or put the blame where it really belongs.

I'm afraid I'm not sure if this is directed toward my support of the IU players or my comments regarding Holloway and Ebanks.

Sampson cheated. He is gone as he should be. I am upset that he lied to IU and upset that he lied to the NCAA. I liked Sampson as a coach and still do, but as a person I do not think much of him. I wish Greenspan was following him out the door as well and I'd also like former President Herbert to answer for the hire. He (Herbert) has deftly avoided that question since the day this came out. However, as far as we know right now none of the current players were recruited via recruiting violations. I have no reason to not support them.

DJ White embraced Dan Dakich after the Northwestern game. It was an embrace between two men that have been through an incredible amount over the past 48 hours. DJ has had a career at IU that no one would envy. He has already had one coach he was extremely close to removed and he stayed on. It has happened to him again. I can only imagine what that does to a young players psyche.

I am one of the most dedicated fans you will ever find when it comes to IU basketball. My dad graduated from here and I love the school and the basketball team. However I don't think I would ever be accused of being too close to the situation. I try to be as impartial as possible when talking about IU. So, yes I will support the players even though some may not agree with their actions. Believe me I have spent quite a bit of the past week dissecting the situation looking at it from every angle possible and I believe my opinions on it are well supported and among my friends well documented.

If you think I am denying the possibility that Ebanks and Holloway may decommit from IU, I must disagree. The possibility does exist, but Peegs.com has quotes from an interview with Holloway saying he is 100% committed to IU, I'd link to it, but you have to pay to be able to read the article. I can only take the kid at his word. If he is giving IU fans lip service then so be it, but I have no reason not to believe Holloway right now. Right now I'll take a direct quote from him over a close source especially being reported by ESPN or Fox Sports. Remember at one point ESPN was reporting that the six players not at practice were threatening to not play the NU game which was 100% untrue so forgive me if I don't currently have a ton of respect for their journalistic integrity.

[Da Coach]

The possibility does exist, but Peegs.com has quotes from an interview with Holloway saying he is 100% committed to IU, I'd link to it, but you have to pay to be able to read the article. I can only take the kid at his word.

I am a subscriber to Peegs.com, so I just read the article and the interview with Holloway, and you say he says "he is 100% committed to IU"

But here are direct clips from Peegs' article--



Holloway has been in communication with Devin Ebanks
We talked to Terrell Holloway earlier this morning on a number of issues, including the coaching change and his current status.
On his commitment to the Hoosiers:
TH: "I'm in a wait and see mindset right now. I haven't talked to Coach Dakich yet, but I'm sure I will. Coach Meyer called me and we talked about everything. I'm still signed with the Hoosiers, but I want to see how everything plays out before I make my final decision."








He never says he is 100% committed. That sounds like something less than 100%.

[brebeuf1fan@iu]

I am a subscriber to Peegs.com, so I just read the article and the interview with Holloway, and you say he says "he is 100% committed to IU"

But here are direct clips from Peegs' article--



Holloway has been in communication with Devin Ebanks
We talked to Terrell Holloway earlier this morning on a number of issues, including the coaching change and his current status.
On his commitment to the Hoosiers:
TH: "I'm in a wait and see mindset right now. I haven't talked to Coach Dakich yet, but I'm sure I will. Coach Meyer called me and we talked about everything. I'm still signed with the Hoosiers, but I want to see how everything plays out before I make my final decision."








He never says he is 100% committed. That sounds like something less than 100%.

When that article was first posted there was a 100% in front of signed.

The original read "I'm still 100% signed with the Hoosiers..."

The author of the article also changed his post on the Peegs message board to remove the 100%.

Like I've said though if Holloway and Ebanks leave then thats fine. It is their loss. IU basketball is bigger than a pair of recruits.

If they want to play here then I will welcome them with open arms. Either way I would wish them the best of luck in their endeavors.

[Da Coach]

I agree with you there. I wish the best for IU. With Dakich, or whoever gets the job, they will be OK.

[IlliBraves]

I'd also say to remember that in the end these are 18-22 year olds and as someone who is similar to them in age I can completely understand where they are coming from. Sampson was so much more than just a basketball coach to them. He was a father figure for many of them and helped many of them improve their games tremendously. Before you rush to judgement I'd ask you to put yourselves in their position at the same age and see how you would react.

I do not buy into this argument in the least. These are kids who have had EVERY advantage. They are being paid in the form of tuition and room and board dollars to play basketball and represent the university. Whether they like it or not, they serve as role models towards the university and their actions reflect up on the university. This whole thing is starting to sound more and more like a joke. If the NCAA doesn't give IU a post-season ban next year, then they might as well call the entire thing off. Either dull out punishments for rules violations or don't have rules at all.

[lefty]

I do not buy into this argument in the least. These are kids who have had EVERY advantage. They are being paid in the form of tuition and room and board dollars to play basketball and represent the university. Whether they like it or not, they serve as role models towards the university and their actions reflect up on the university. This whole thing is starting to sound more and more like a joke. If the NCAA doesn't give IU a post-season ban next year, then they might as well call the entire thing off. Either dull out punishments for rules violations or don't have rules at all.

I don't mean to speak for the IU fan here IB but I don't see what his post and yours have in common. The sanctions the NCAA may or may not impose have nothing to do with current players decision to skip a practice.

I think our IU friend here has been pretty objective.....although Istill can't stand Indiana

[tornado]

Here are more details........

"Letter of intents normally come as a two year binding agreement unless the school releases you from that agreement. Ebanks along with Terrell Holloway are the two signees that in Rick Greenspan's language on Friday have
"a provision that if there was a tournament ban or a change of coaches---that they would have an opportunity to get a release from that NLI."

Most schools would hold out on a release until the new coach was in place and had at least the opportunity to resell his program to the signee. Indiana may not have that luxury with these two signees. In fact sources close to Ebanks indicate to us that he is likely to receive his release from Indiana later this week. The same source indicates that he expects that the same is likely to happen to Holloway as well. Holloway and Ebanks are both from the New York City area and friends who have communicated often throughout the winter.

The source does indicate that both players are likely not going to open up their recruitment to more than three or four schools and that Indiana will be a part of that eventual short list. This may allow for a new Hoosier coach to make his pitch to each player and make a case for a "re-signing" in April."
...per premium story on Rivals/Indiana with quotes from the press release from IU.



Again..even though there is extensive discussion about Ebanks and Holloway,
and there are long threads on both the open board and premium board...guess what..
No mention of Matt Roth....nobody in any thread even brings up the subject of Roth.



Lastly, a great article on Indiana and Kelvin Sampson:
"Moral high ground missing"

http://www.southbendtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080223/SPORTS10/802230336/1001/Sports

[IlliBraves]

I don't mean to speak for the IU fan here IB but I don't see what his post and yours have in common. The sanctions the NCAA may or may not impose have nothing to do with current players decision to skip a practice.

I think our IU friend here has been pretty objective.....although Istill can't stand Indiana

Well, other than the last few sentences, I'm just saying that what he said about the players being young kids and making mistakes is a bogus argument for skipping practice. I should have separated that from what I am saying about the sanctions. Anyways, what I meant was that I have heard numerous Indiana fans claim they have some "inside" knowledge that Indiana will not get a post season ban next year, which would be completely unfair and unjust in regards to keeping a fair and level playing field. But yes, I am self-appointing myself world's biggest Indiana hater, or schadenfreud fan as Mac likes to call me

[Da Coach]

Montana Tech still plans to name it's home court after Kelvin Sampson--

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/02/24/sports/BKC-Montana-Tech-Sampson-Court.php

http://www.wlfi.com/Global/story.asp?S=7918440&nav=menu591_5

http://www.missoulian.com/articles/2008/02/25/sports/zsports02.txt

[tornado]

Again..even though there is extensive discussion about Ebanks and Holloway,
and there are long threads on both the open board and premium board...guess what..
No mention of Matt Roth....nobody in any thread even brings up the subject of Roth.

Here is the same phenomenon again..........

Rivals does a HUGE article, it goes on for paragraph after paragraph, and it's all about what Indiana does from here, what about the future, what about their incoming and pledged recruits, who's their next coach going to be, etc., etc.

I will reproduce the story below, but mainly just to show one thing...
That they don't mention Matt Roth at, even though they mention all the other committed recruits, and also even mention just about every other potential future recruit IU could have even had on their radar...
BUT NO MATT ROTH...
It is alomst as he doesn't matter to Indiana, as if nobody there even cares if he comes or goes...
I sure hope Matt reads this..........

http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=779056

Here's the text...
"February 26, 2008

Hope for the Hoosiers

After divorcing itself from Kelvin Sampson, Indiana University is left with one question on the basketball recruiting front: What now?

A number of programs have dealt with similar situations. Some thrived. Some struggled. Some are still trying to find their way. It remains to be seen into which category Indiana will fall.


Devin Ebanks has a short list of schools he will consider if he doesn't stick with Indiana.
There is a provision in the Letter of Intent for 2008 Indiana signees Devin Ebanks and Terrell Holloway that would allow the two to opt out of their pledge to the Hoosiers in the event of Sampson being fired and/or the team being put on a postseason ban.

According to a source close to Ebanks, the five-star prospect and his mother have yet to hear from Indiana athletic director Rick Greenspan. The source close to Ebanks said there are two to four schools that Ebanks will consider.

"He will not re-open his recruitment, just explore those (two to four) schools," the source said.

Ebanks also considered Texas, Rutgers and Miami prior to signing with Indiana.

Holloway recently told Inside Indiana and Peegs.com that he was "in a wait-and-see mind-set right now??¦I'm still signed with the Hoosiers, but I want to see how everything plays out before I make my final decision."

Indiana is in a state of flux right now regarding recruiting. Class of 2009 prospect Derek Elston has remained steadfast in his pledge to the Hoosiers. Indianapolis big man Stephan Van Treese says he is waiting to see who Indiana hires before further contemplating his interest with the Big Ten program.

Other top level prospects have developed strong relationships with the current staff and Sampson. Nolan Dennis, John Wall, Lance Stephenson, Jon Hood and Leslie McDonald, just to name a few, were on the recruiting board under Sampson's direction.

Time, along with the announcement on who the new coach will be, will tell the story as to the interest level for each individual prospect.

The Future


One of the first orders of business for the new IU coach will likely be to go hard after Fort Wayne native DeShaun Thomas.
According to a handful of coaches that have taken a job at a school that is coming off a scandal of sorts, it takes a year to at least lay the foundation for a new attitude.

Translation for in Indiana? Keep an eye on the class of 2010 for recruiting.

The current class of sophomores are strong from an IU perspective. Fort Wayne native DeShaun Thomas - a 2010 on-again, off-again commitment to Ohio State - is one of the top players in his class nationally. He has been to Bloomington on an unofficial visit this season.

Other in-state prospects include Dominique Ferguson of Lawrence North in Indianapolis, Danville Community center Travis Carroll and Ray McCallum, the son of the current IU assistant coach of the same name.

The Hoosiers have laid some groundwork with the likes of Chad Jackson of Kentucky, Pe'Shon Howard from Ohio, Tobias Harris from New York, Lavonte Dority from Illinois, Allen Payne and Adreian Payne of Ohio, and others.

The regional talent pool is strong. That has helped other programs rebuild quickly ??“ just look at fellow Big Ten school Ohio State.

The Precedent

Jim O'Brien was fired from Ohio State because he admitted giving a recruit $6,000 five years prior to his ousting. The program needed a shot in the arm and someone that could help the Buckeyes re-establish their prestige. O'Brien helped lead OSU to the national championship game in 1999.

Thad Matta, who shined at Butler and Xavier before taking over the Big Ten school, went right to work on the recruiting front for Ohio State as soon as he was hired in July 2004.


Thad Matta made a name on the recruiting trail upon his arrival at Ohio State.
His efforts resulted in major signees. Matta landed the second best class nationally in 2006, highlighted by Greg Oden, Mike Conley and Dequan Cook. The Buckeyes made it to the NCAA title game a year later.

The Buckeyes have shined on the recruiting front since 2006, landing the No. 7 class in 2007. The Buckeyes signed the sixth best class nationally in 2008. Matta has the makings of a No. 1 class for 2010 already.

Another school that has its program on the mend is Baylor. The Bears suffered one of the worst tragedies in college basketball history when Patrick Dennehy was murder by teammate Carlton Dotson. Head coach Dave Bliss reportedly told his players to lie to investigators during the murder investigation. Along the way, numerous violations were discovered.

Bliss was obviously fired, and the rebuilding process began. Rehabbing the Baylor program would take time, and Scott Drew and his staff knew that. After a number of quality recruiting classes, Baylor is now on the bubble to make the NCAA tournament this season.

Post-scandal success has been more difficult to find for some programs. Missouri hasn't been the same since Quin Snyder and the Tigers parted ways.

Missouri began to fall apart in early January 2003 when guard Ricky Clemons was arrested for allegedly assaulting his former girlfriend. During his time in jail, Clemons said other players received money from assistant coaches. The damage had been done.

The program lost three scholarships over two years and couldn't go on the road to recruit for a year. Some suggest that the scandal may have cost the program a legitimate shot at in-state star Tyler Hansbrough ??“ who signed with North Carolina - and Brandon Rush, who ended up signing with Kansas.

Mike Anderson took over the Missouri program after a successful run at UAB. In his short time at Missouri, the Tigers have struggled - particularly with off-the-court issues. The team's leading scorer, Stefhon Hannah, was kicked off the team for his role in an altercation outside a nightclub.

Georgia is in a similar situation to Missouri. Jim Harrick and son, Jim, Jr., were accused of paying a $300 phone bill for ex-player Tony Cole. Harrick, Jr. later became infamous for an exam he gave to students ??“ many of whom were basketball players - in a Physical Education course.

Dennis Felton was hired to rebuild the program and the image of the basketball team. Prior to this season, the Bulldogs had improved each year under Felton's direction. This season, Felton has dismissed the team's top two scorers ??“ Mike Mercer and Takais Brown. Center Rashad Singleton quit the team at the semester break and Billy Humphrey was suspended in mid-season for three games.

Georgia is .500 on the season, and may be close to starting the long climb back up the SEC standings. The Bulldogs cracked the national team recruiting rankings this season, checking in at No. 30 after signing Howard Thompkins, Dustin Ware and Drazen Zlovaric.

The Solution?

Indiana shouldn't have any problems landing players that can help restore the Hoosiers as a full-time national power. Mike Davis reeled in Alabama native D.J. White from SEC country. Sampson snagged Eric Gordon away from Illinois.

For whomever is next in line, landing a marquee player is essential. That way of thinking has proved to be successful at other schools that have tried to right the ship in a hurry.


I guess any reader is forced to ask....
Matt who??

[IlliBraves]

I hope Roth leaves Indiana and stays in-state. Any team in Illinois would be thrilled to have him. Stay in-state, Matt. Don't go to the dark side!!

[tornado]

Sampson's firing seem to have created the fear of threats towards the Indiana Administrators, and now they are being provided security...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/basketball/ncaa/wires/02/27/2060.ap.bkc.indiana.security.0233/

[Rusty 54]

I hope Roth leaves Indiana and stays in-state. Any team in Illinois would be thrilled to have him. Stay in-state, Matt. Don't go to the dark side!!

I consider ISU and SIU the dark side

[tornado]

Indiana's top recruit, 5-Star Devin Ebanks, is done with his high school career, as his team, St. Thomas More, lost in the Nation Prep Championships to Hargrave. Ebanks was said to still be considering Indiana even though Sampson is gone, but now the report says this:
"Now, he turns his attention to possibly decommitting from Indiana and searching for another school."
But rumor says he is not likely to stay with Indiana.

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/weiss/2008/03/court-scuffle-mars-otherwise-e.html

[Da Coach]

Also note the top part of that article linked in the above post. It reports that The Patterson School was beaten by Notre Dame Prep. There was a scuffle that involved former BU recruit Courtney Fortson, an Arkansas commit.

A couple Patterson kids are also noted to be Bradley recruits, Varez Ward and Darius Johnson-Odom. Now that their season is over, they will likely make school visits and soon commit.