Joe Lunardi Article on ESPN +

[houstonbrave]

There is an interesting Joe Lunardi article on ESPN + (have to be a subscriber) which the guys on The March to the Arch podcast pointed out.

It makes the case that teams should have a .500 record for At-Large consideration for the NCAA tournament. He does advocate that Conference Tournament wins (but for some reason not losses) should count toward the .500 record.

He outlines data which says that teams that got in with records below .500 since 2013-4 had an average of a 10 seed and a record of 3-10 record. While mid major at-large teams had an average seed of 10.75 and a record of 12-12.

This does seem to again reinforce the fact that the middling P5 teams are not as good as the strong mid-majors. In fact since the P5 at large teams had higher seeds (and therefore played supposedly weaker opponents) they should have had a better record than the mid-majors.

I am not sure you really need to add the complexity of “adding” the conference tournament wins. To me the simple method should be if you don’t have a .500 record in your conference regular season your only path to the tournament should be to win the conference tournament.
I am not sure how that impacts the analysis but it sure seems fair.

[Tommy]

When has anyone made the tournament with a losing record where they didn't win their conference tournament? I don't recollect that ever happening?

[houstonbrave]

It does not happen if you are a mid-major. It happens in the P5 conferences-10 sub .500 conference record teams since 2013-14.

[Tommy]

It does not happen if you are a mid-major. It happens in the P5 conferences-10 sub .500 conference record teams since 2013-14.

Wow, that's ridiculous. I had no idea.

[egib52]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/02/16/this-ncaa-tournament-getting-with-losing-conference-record-isnt-such-stretch/

[Da Coach]

As that Washington Post article states, some have proposed that teams with a losing conference record should not be allowed to get at-large bids. This does not apply to teams that have a losing record overall. No team with a losing overall record has ever gotten an at-large bid, though there have been many Power 6 conference teams with losing conference records who have gotten at-large bids in the past.
There have been 18 teams with losing records that have gotten bids, and six more that had .500 records, all of which got automatic bids. They were all mid-majors and low-majors who won their conference tournaments and got automatic bids. Here they are-

https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/bracketiq/2020-01-20/march-madness-history-teams-worst-records-make-ncaa

[LittleBrave]

Just to clarify - losing record in conference play. I am pretty sure NOBODY has ever made it with an Overall losing record - that would be shameful!

[BUSongwriter]

As of today, Indiana, Ohio State, Purdue, and Minnesota all have losing records in conference and are in positions 9-12 in the Big 10. And I would bet that at least three of them, if not all of them, get into the dance before UNI if the Panthers don't win the MVC tournament. How exciting to see an 11th or 12th place conference team take the court in the Big Dance!

[Dubl R 1]

Ok.. Evansville has a losing record in the MVC.

But they were 9-4 in the non con with a win over then ranked #1 Kentucky ON THE ROAD.

Throw out that meaningless conference record and they are in!!!!!

[Tommy]

As that Washington Post article states, some have proposed that teams with a losing conference record should not be allowed to get at-large bids. This does not apply to teams that have a losing record overall. No team with a losing overall record has ever gotten an at-large bid, though there have been many Power 6 conference teams with losing conference records who have gotten at-large bids in the past.
There have been 18 teams with losing records that have gotten bids, and six more that had .500 records, all of which got automatic bids. They were all mid-majors and low-majors who won their conference tournaments and got automatic bids. Here they are-
https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball...ords-make-ncaa

Thanks Coach. You must have picked up on my mis-understanding, didn't you? Reading quickly at work I missed the 'conference' part of the losing record. Either way, if they cut out losing conference records, that could only help mid-majors. That would be a wonderful change (but the NCAA will never allow that to happen).

[Tommy]

Ok.. Evansville has a losing record in the MVC.

But they were 9-4 in the non con with a win over then ranked #1 Kentucky ON THE ROAD.

Throw out that meaningless conference record and they are in!!!!!

Evansville beat Kentucky and they haven't won a conference game all year, so by proxy, the entire MVC is better than Kentucky.