Dave Reynolds article about the lack of D1 talent from Peoria in recent years

[Da Coach]

Out of the cradle: Reasons abound for decline of Division I basketball prosepects from Peoria

http://www.pjstar.com/article/20140820/SPORTS/140829878/1020/SPORTS

Dave evaluates a lot of reasons why there has been a big dropoff in talent from Peoria, but most of his reasons should be the same everywhere. But this phenomenon has not been happening as much in other cities, so I am not sure there aren't still other reasons.

[ihatetea]

New York centric, similar article detailing New York's relative decline: http://grantland.com/features/nyc-ba...konchalsk-nba/
ESPN article referenced by Reynolds (I believe): http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebaske...tball-is-dying
(Warning, grantland (1st article detailing New York's similar decline is/might be ungratifying to non-New Yorkers and is fairly long))

Personal feelings -- the lack of street ball is less a failing of Peoria basketball and more endemic of a new generation of basketball. In the past, playing pickup games represented the best way to play many, many games and grow as a basketball player. Now they call that AAU. If I had to offer an opinion on the difference of the two represented generations, the referenced style of the junior high schedules is much more profitable. At that time of growth in a youngster's development, more practices is more important than more games. However, saying that AAU is the problem is merely a segment of the problem. If you elimanted AAU, people would say that high school players don't have enough fundamentals, which would result in the blaming of high school coaches and thusly the blaming of junior high coaches. End of story, someone has to take responsibility, and the best option is to re-expand junior high schedules and add more practices in a similar style as described by Dave. Or eliminatling AAU through high school, an option that is highly unsavory to too many people that collect too much money. All things considered, the longer schedule I didn't know about before now from junior high definitly sounds more reasonable.

In a similar argument, blaming social media/video games ignores the fact that prep schools and schools such as Findlay Prep and others leach good players that otherwise would stay local. La Lumiose (sorry on spelling) of Indiana attracts numerous players that ultimately are D1 borderline-at-least level talents, yet the promise of more lands them at a non-Illinois high school/prep level school. Both leech players from Illinois based schools. Case in point, La Lumiere of Indiana has attracted numerous recruits of D1 end destination. (Regardless of the fact that many of them have failed to perform to expert expectation, they would have been D1 commits, frequently from Illinois, fulfilling the requirements of the article)

At the end of the day, I would simply say that the Peoria area is in a slow period. My direct example: My hometown over the previous 6 years before my graduation we had 3 players that made it to the D1 baseball level. In the 2 years following, we had 6 players make D1. However, over the following 7 years, one young man has made to the D1 level total. Peoria is small enough that ebbs and flows drastically effect the amount of D1 talent, especially once prep schools are involved.

End of story, the lack of basketball talent in regards to prior talent level is regrettable, however, it will rebound. And if it doesn't come back to the previous high levels, there is probably a reasonable amount of migration to established/prep schools that aren't central Illinois based that can account for the decline.

Sorry if that got long winded and/or off point, I just wanted to include my entire opinion, with arguments where I saw benefit.

[ihatetea]

As a more directed argument:

I hadn't known of the longer schedule for junior high. I didn't know that there was that much more time built in for practice in the past. To me, it makes perfect sense that there would be that much time built in to a junior high schedule for practice as described.



As an aside: I can see how AAU has developed over the last 40 or so years as it would make sense for the elite. Significant games against the toughest competition creates the best possible outcomes. However, that comes at the expense of the above average/pretty good and creates a shortcoming of the Illinois based D1 basketball talents.

End of the day, I don't think this affects Bradley, yet is important to those that follow local Illinois talent, even if it doesn't affect the parents of the young.

[tornado]

it is cyclic and always has been...but we've been talking about this current down cycle since back in 2008-2009 when many saw this coming

but there have been other gaps in the bulk of talent, look at 2005-2008 - only a couple marginal D-I players and college benchsitters
..same for 90-93...



Here are a couple factors I see:

#1 - that Peoria city kids, if they really have talent early at an early age, then they sometimes find a way to get out of Peoria and finish their high school careers elsewhere - thus they are NOT grads of Peoria schools.
obviously there's Dyricus Simms-Edwards, Bobo Drummond, DJ Richardson

But also - recall Donivine Stewart and several of his Limestone teammates were actually Peoria kids (Manual, Woodruff) but transferred out of the city to finish their high school careers...
..so did AJ Riley and his bad choices hurt his D-I chances or he might be playing D-I today and been on that list for 2013 -
......which had he been then the entire premise for this column - a 2-year gap - would be gone.
and this phenomenon is still going on

#2 - real decline in the education these kids get in the city - such that eligibility issues plague them and ultimately destroy or severely hamper any chance of D-I
Ahmad Grant - who never even played HS ball because of eligibilty probs - but still made it to D-I -- might have been even better had he played HS ball
There's also kids like Andrew Jordan, Kevin Jordan, Aldonis Foote, Myles Boone - these Central kids WON THE 2012 STATE CHAMPIONSHIP - so there wasn't a lack of talent in 2012 despite the D-I gap!! But none of them were ever able to get their academics straight and that hurt them -
Where to put that blame?? Schools & school district, teachers, parents...you decide.

[midstateknowitall]

Interesting article by Dave. Seems a little like everyone is pointing a finger at something different. I will tell you the biggest problem. GRADES/TEST SCORES and SCHOOL DISTRICT.

There has been plenty of D1 talent: AJ RILEY, PRESTON WELLS, ALDONIS FOOTE, KEVIN JORDAN. That's just 2012-2013 all would've been D1 guys if they had their academics in order.

The best thing DJ Richardson, Dyricus Simms-Edwards, and Bobo Drummond did was get out of Peoria. They went to places that focused on their development in the classroom as much as they did on the court. Made sure they were doing what is necessary to qualify. It would have probably been a toss up in Peoria if they stayed. .

2016 Class (Juniors this year) & beyond now have to have at least at 2.3GPA in Core Classes. Test scores (ACT & SAT) will be on sliding scales. The lower your GPA is, the higher your test score has to be. Prospects also must successfully complete 10 of the 16 total required core courses before the start of their senior year in high school. Seven of the 10 courses must be successfully completed in English, math and science.

This is going to be a major issue for a lot of kids. Parents & Players now a days tend to think they don't need to focus that much on grades and that their skill on that basketball floor will trump the lack of scores and gpa required.

Im not saying that there hasn't been a drop in skill development, or passion that some lack now a days: But this article probably never is written if PSD150 schools were a little bit better. Not saying its all the districts fault (parents & players have to take responsibility as well), but I don't see any of the schools academic side increasing.

JUST MY OPINOIN....

[Da Coach]

Good assessment. I think you are right.

[tornado]

...

There has been plenty of D1 talent: AJ RILEY, PRESTON WELLS, ALDONIS FOOTE, KEVIN JORDAN. That's just 2012-2013 all would've been D1 guys if they had their academics in order.

The best thing DJ Richardson, Dyricus Simms-Edwards, and Bobo Drummond did was get out of Peoria. ...

JUST MY OPINOIN.......

and from what I understand, you were right there & knew all those kids well......and you probably have one of the best vantage points to know that
Sad that many of those kids have no other options as their family finances preclude going to any other schools or paying tuition....

As I have said many times before - the state funds the Peoria schools at a rate of $12-15,000 per kid and they still whine that they have no $$ and thus cannot do a decent job.

Meanwhile, numerous nearby PRIVATE schools, some who have a 100% graduation rate with 96% going on to college - can fully educate a high school kid for about $5-6,000 per student and they are NOT going broke nor whining about being unable to do it.

Problem is the public schools have their minds set how they want to do it and even if they are failing miserably they'll be da**ed if they'd ever peek over at how the successful people are doing it because that would be an admission of THEIR FAILURE!
also - from the TOP position on down their system is so filled with party-politics, butt-kissing, greed, you-scratch-my-back-and-I'll-scratch-yours, patronage-job-opportunities, and simple incompetence.
I have children (adopted) who have gone to District 150 schools - but they are not there now - and it took a few years to correct the complete vacuum and laziness that D-150 left in their minds - but it was do-able.
I know there are many GOOD people, GOOD administrators, and GOOD students in District 150 but they are a dying breed and constantly the people at the top feel threatened by anyone in the system that actually looks good or gets awards for their excellence so the big-wigs MUST see that those stellar workers are run out.

[tornado]

BTW - do you know who it was that was responsible for that
GREAT Peoria -> to -> U of I Pipeline???

well, a lot of people get credit from Dick Van Scyoc, to his assistants, Chuck Westendorf, and especially Wayne McClain,...

but here's a quote from Wayne McClain, and he gives all the credit to ex-BU assistant ROB JUDSON!

"... the guy I did most of my talking with was (then-UI assistant) Rob Judson...
..."We had a relationship in Peoria at the time. He was an assistant at Bradley, and we got to know each other.

"And he came over (from Bradley to be on staff at Illinois) with Lon Kruger.
So that really cemented the whole situation with me.
I'll be honest with you, if Rob Judson wasn't here, I don't even know if our kids would have come to Illinois.
And I'm being honest about that. He made it so comfortable for us. I liked the school, then I had somebody I could trust. That was important."
...so Wayne McClain gives the credit to Rob Judson and he says that if Judson wasn't there at U of I - he doesn't know if any of the Manual kids would have landed at Illinois!

http://www.news-gazette.com/sports/illini-sports/mens-basketball/2011-03-15/man-middle-mcclain-binds-three-staffs.html

[tornado]

BTW - I have a few more for Dave Reynolds' D-I list

Ahmid Palmer - Peoria Central High School - was said to have played at Central Florida - LINK
Isaiah Duncan - http://www.goleathernecks.com/roster...h=&rp_id=12006
plus one Da Coach recalled, Jermaine Wallace

[Da Coach]

Dave's article lists Peoria's (city only) Division I players.

http://www.pjstar.com/article/20140820/SPORTS/140829878/1020/SPORTS

I have found a couple more names that aren't on his list. Maybe these guys were walk-ons, which Dave's list does not seem to include. Does anyone know?

Manual grad Isaiah Duncan played 1 season at Western Illinois-

http://basketball.realgm.com/player/Isaiah-Duncan/Summary/46322

Peoria Central grad Jermaine Wallace played 2 seasons at High Point University just after they turned Division I-

http://basketball.realgm.com/player/Jermaine-Wallace/Summary/16128

Speaking of walk-ons, here are a few more-

Ryan Phillips was a walk-on at Bradley for 4 full seasons, though I believe he did earn a scholarship for 1 or 2 semesters under Jim Les, when another scholarship player left and there was an extra scholarship-

http://basketball.realgm.com/player/Ryan-Phillips/Summary/7062

James Robertson was another Richwoods grad who spent a season at Bradley as a walk-on-

http://basketball.realgm.com/player/James-Robertson/Summary/7069

Mason Alwan was also a walk-on at Bradley for 2 seasons-

http://basketball.realgm.com/player/Mason-Alwan/Summary/42579

And Richwoods grad Matt Coates was a walk-on at ISU for 2 or 3 seasons-

http://basketball.realgm.com/player/Matt-Coates/Summary/7300

[saluki762]

I wouldn't call Bobo Drummond a D1 talent.

[Da Coach]

I wouldn't call Bobo Drummond a D1 talent.

That could be debated with a lot of the kids on Dave's list. But Bobo did get D1 scholarship offers.

[saluki762]

That could be debated with a lot of the kids on Dave's list. But Bobo did get D1 scholarship offers.

He did have multiple. He is playing for a very good coach and man now at USI.

[tornado]

I wouldn't call Bobo Drummond a D1 talent.

they weren't all overhwhelming top D-I talent but that they were D-I and at a certain point surely had the potential
...and given a better overall situaiton that included academically, could have developed without the academic woes - and had a much better chance

[Da Coach]

I recall seeing Bobo at a Flash Flanagan event at the Markin Center several years ago. He absolutely dominated every other player there. He looked like he was a high-major caliber kid at that time, and he was getting calls from Kansas, Cincinnati, and other high majors schools. But something changed, and I can only speculate what it was, and he has struggled since he left Central. I think he lost confidence when he went to the prep school, but there may be other reasons.