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  • Toughness

    sure to draw some debate - let's talk about the most prevalent current topic...
    sorry about the long post & lots of thoughts - but feel free to challenge - this is what a message board is all about


    Each of the last couple games has drawn a fairly harsh criticism from our local press about our guys' TOUGHNESS.

    one column called out their toughness in rebounding - LINK
    and another called out their overall toughness - LINK

    Well - I am going to stand up for our guys and take issue here for several reasons.

    #1-It's one thing to be critical of shooting, skills, even coaching moves - but challenging multiple players' "toughness" is claiming somehow you are an expert psychiatrist and that you can get inside their heads and know how they think and how they're driven - how dare some guy who sits on his butt and makes a living watching games and criticizing - throw our kids under the bus.
    It's one thing to be critical of shooting, skills, even coaching moves - AND - didn't they tell us how incredibly tough our players are -

    #2- I am 100% convinced they are wrong - I think we do have just as much toughness as any team in the MVC. If you don't see it you are not looking.
    Walt is tough - maybe one of the toughest kids in the league. He'll fight anyone, dive on the floor, and give you 100%. - someone even has an avatar of Walt toughing up against an opponent - LINK LINK LINK
    Then - anyone want to say Tyshon Pickett isn't tough? Constantly battling bigger guys, giving 100%, among the leaders in both scoring & rebounding.
    (actually he LEADS the entire league in rebounding at present)
    Ka'Darryl Bell played half last season with a ripped up shoulder, never complained and even caused a delay in the decision to do surgery because he played hard despite the pain. then when he had his shoulder surgery - he came back to 100% in record time. Sorry - KB is tough.
    Chris Blake?? OMG - you are talking tough inside & out. I know he doesn't score but the issue is toughness. CB is as tough as you get.
    ..and our past guys as well - Chris Roberts, Dyricus, Sammy, Jake, Dodie, and guys like WE & San Singh playing with broken bones in their face.

    So just who are the toughest guys in the entire MVC?
    I can't name one on ISU or SIU - maybe Ballentine, Gant, and a couple Shockers & UNI guys.
    BUT seriously if we had to name a TOP TEN TOUGH GUYS in the MVC - I hafta think we get four of the TOP spots.


    #Lastly - I like talking about this topic but tough isn't all you need. Even a skinny, soft guy that can hit 45% on his jumpers is still a pretty important piece that somehow we have failed to recruit.
    Remember the SIU teams from 2008 thru 2012?? Filled with super tough guys (Fay, Mullins, Hare, Dillard, Teague, Freeman, Seck, and Jeff Early - a 6-1 guy who led the league in rebounding!) but nobody could hit the broad side of a barn or play team-ball, and they repeatedly lost 15 to 23 games every year and got Lowery fired.
    Last edited by tornado; 12-04-2013, 09:43 AM.

  • #2
    FORD TOUGH! I say we give our toughest effort of the yr tonight D UP and REBOUND!

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    • #3
      Toughness wasn't the issue -
      execution, game plan, motivation ...
      Maybe it's time to try a trick that I saw HOF Kentucky coach Joe B. Hall use once in an NCAA game...
      His starting players were playing sluggishly, they were losing badly - so he came out in the 2nd half and started five subs & walk-on players
      The ploy worked - the walk-on's relished their rare chance and played unbelievably then the starters came back in and played like their playing time depended on quality play.

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      • #4
        The code word after the Illini, ASU, and UTPA games was "toughness"

        Now it seems to be "inexperienced".....that we are playing badly because we are an inexperienced team.
        I have seen & heard that term numerous times today - in the press, from fans, etc...
        BUT - I contend in many ways we are one of the more experienced teams around. Everyone has new players, not just us....
        - come on - stop using that as an alibi.
        Plus - we don't lose players to the NBA like top schools do - even Illinois (Leonard, Richmond) and even POB, and GF is well into his 3rd recruiting cycle so he's had plenty of time - more time that the majority of MVC coaches to get the players he wants for this league.

        And add to that - that we intentionally get rid of two of our more experienced 3rd year players who also had an extra year of prep school under their belts (Shayok & Jalen) just so we could go after even more experienced, older, more mature players (Blake, Barnes)
        ...and Geno is one of the very few coaches whose W-L record is distinctly better because of a rare 6th year guy helping give us a few wins.

        Also we had a huge running start this year, on most other teams by having everyone on campus all summer, and
        gaining a couple dozen extra practices and five extra early exhibition games - Plus now we're even nearly 1/3 into this season playing the majority of our minutes with experienced guys.

        Our main players include:
        - one 5th year senior
        - four fourth year guys - some of whom have been starters from the get-go everywhere they've been including Bradley (Blake, Barnes, Pickett, Lemon)
        - two third year guys who we intentionally targeted for additional experience and skills (Fields, Grier) plus other 3rd year guys (Wells)
        - one 2nd year guy (Bell) - the only guy with less that 3 years of college experience who plays more than 12 mpg
        -and really only three freshmen - none of whom we rely much on although two of them had extra prep school experience as well as extra international playing experience (SZ & Swop)

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        • #5
          Originally posted by tornado View Post
          sure to draw some debate - let's talk about the most prevalent current topic........our guys' TOUGHNESS....
          rehash of an older thread....

          surely most fans recall....our press called out players early on in Geno era for lack of toughness....
          Personally, I thought this was a terribly low blow since I believed our guys like Jake Eastman, Dyricus, Walt Lemon, were VERY tough players...

          then...incredulously - our press started telling us that the new guys brought in - the Chicago guys like Mike Shaw, Jermaine Morgan, Xavier Taylor, plus Chris Blake, Omari Grier, Warren Jones - were all far tougher and would be great team leaders...
          and of course that turned out to be wrong as well.........

          Anyway - here's what the rest of the Valley press are saying about Bradley now...and I fully agree



          Even KW now calling Bradley tough

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