Final: Illinois State 79 Bradley 59

[Old Coach]

BTW -- what does everyone think of their "announced attendance"...8417..
that's 500 fewer than they had last game, a 35 point annihilation of the last place team, SIU..
It's a little better than they drew the past couple years...but it's disappointing that such a rivalry game can't sell out either here or there...
I guess I'd take that as pretty strong proof of fans who may be lost for quite some time to come...

There was a very large Bradley student section in the upper deck. More than have been at many home games.

[LittleBrave]

How did Bell and Crawford look?

These guys are gonna be a big part of this team the next couple seasons, and we desperately need them to step up and improve.

[LittleBrave]

And what the heck happened in the last 8 minutes when we were only down by 2?

In past road games when we were down by 5 or so, we rushed and forced shots, passed very little, ran out of gas. I'm assuming the same happened last night?

[wily coyote]

Has anyone ever seen the charge/block called as a double foul? What the heck was that call? Is that even allowed?

Yes unfortunatly I've seen it called several times in my career. When I was officiating ,it was a two man crew and could and did happen more than you see it today. It is a double foul when two officials have a different block/charge call on the same play. Doesn't happen often but it does if one official doesn't back off the call. When both officials have committed with the proper block/charge signal it is hard to back off and a double foul usually occurs and thats what happened on that play. The penalty is as follows, both players are given a foul and possession goes to the alternating possession arrow. In this case it was ISU's arrow,hence they got the ball. After seeing the replay it looks to me that the official calling a block got the call right but in reality even if we don't agree the officials,they did get the penalty correct with the call as it was made.

[shaunguth]

Stay classy ISU fans.... nice chant they had going there. What a great fan base they have over there in Bloomington/Normal.

Really? Did you expect anything else?

I hope the day never comes when Bradley students wave "FU ISU" signs and start chanting the same thing.

Stay classy!

[tornado]

Yes unfortunatly I've seen it called several times in my career. When I was officiating ,it was a two man crew and could and did happen more than you see it today. It is a double foul when two officials have a different block/charge call on the same play. Doesn't happen often but it does if one official doesn't back off the call. When both officials have committed with the proper block/charge signal it is hard to back off and a double foul usually occurs and thats what happened on that play. The penalty is as follows, both players are given a foul and possession goes to the alternating possession arrow. In this case it was ISU's arrow,hence they got the ball. After seeing the replay it looks to me that the official calling a block got the call right but in reality even if we don't agree the officials,they did get the penalty correct with the call as it was made.

but wily - don't you think the only reason that double call ever happens is when two refs who see a block/charge situation differently are BOTH unwilling to yield on their opinions...
The truth is that EXACT same play happens a couple times IN EVERY COLLEGE BASKETBALL GAME I have ever seen and 99% of the time the refs huddle and one is willing to yield to the other who might have been in better position - and thus one call (popular or not) is made instead of TWO --
The double foul is thus only when two refs are stubborn and insistent on claiming they are right.

[SFP]

agree with what is now pretty much the unanimous assessment...our offensive & defensive game plans are not getting it done for 40 minutes.
After looking at times like a 4, 5 or 6 seed, now we look like an 8-9 seed...

we try too hard to rely on outside stuff - we are NOT a good outside shooting team! - may work short term but rarely will we sustain the whole game

guards - too much dribble drive & one-on-one - no passing, very few assists from guards....when your forwards lead the team in assists and they only touch the ball 20% as much as the guards - then we need more passing from the guards

gave up way, way too many open looks to the only two guys that were going to hurt us... Brown & Jackie can even make some of the contested shots but they make all the wide open ones - especially when we let them dribble right to the hoop or camp there.

too many totally unforced mistakes for such an experienced group - stepping on end line, tossing passes into the 3rd row, hurrying shots

Pretty much how I feel T! I wonder how much of a difference DSE would have made. I'm still not a big fan of WL as our PG when we are running our set offense. He seems to stop our motion offense so he can take the ball and dribble a bit and try to create his own shot. This team is a very poor passing/assist team all around. There was one instance where WE got the ball through back up to JE, WE was covered by a much smaller guy and JE proceeded to jack up a contested 3 instead getting the ball back to WE who had the much better match up. These guys for some reason are not mentally slowing the game down in order to play to our strengths. We were just jacking up balls like a Paul Westphal team.

For those who are not familiar with him http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Westphal

[wily coyote]

but wily - dontcha think the only reason that double call ever happens is when two refs who see a block/charge situaiton differently are BOTH unwilling to yield on their opinions...
The truth is that EXACT same play happens a couple times IN EVERY COLLEGE BASKETBALL GAME I have ever seen and 99% of the time the refs huddle and one is willing to yield to the other who might have been in better position - and thus one call (popular or not) is made instead of TWO --
The double foul is thus only when two refs are stubborn and insistent on claiming they are right.

Yes ,you are probably right egos could play a role in situations like this.It shouldn't but sometimes it does. It's when they make differing signals that TV ,coaches and all can see is when they are stuck between a rock and a hard spot. All 3 officials are responsible for calls in their own area. It's when one official wonders out of his area of responsibilty you end up with unfortunate calls like this.

You are also right, in that it does happen more than most people realize. I wouldn't say it happens a couple times in every game but I've seen it happen several times. Usually one official quickly lowers his arm as fast as he can. Its when both have committed that they have a problem. When they huddle ,if one backs off it's because the call was not in his area of responsibilty or they will tell the coach one officials whistle was before the others. Very weak excuse but some do use it. Hope that helps.

[Nacho]

Really? Did you expect anything else?

I hope the day never comes when Bradley students wave "FU ISU" signs and start chanting the same thing.

Stay classy!

About as classy as Egolf's foul on Carmichael right? hmmmm... lets see... what is more worse, a chant, or an intentional foul that could injure one of the best players in the league... hmmmmm Now I realize Egolf did not intend to injure Jackie, but his actions still could have caused an injury...

[SFP]

About as classy as Egolf's foul on Carmichael right? hmmmm... lets see... what is more worse, a chant, or an intentional foul that could injure one of the best players in the league... hmmmmm Now I realize Egolf did not intend to injure Jackie, but his actions still could have caused an injury...

WE's foul has nothing to do with classy or trashy! It was mindless I'll concede and I'm not sure what was going through his mind but one thing is that he was not trying to hurt him but prevent an easy slam.

That was also a good example of our help side D not helping.

[tornado]

Will's foul was far more soft & gentle than many of the others including some against us...
one single play in a game can hardly be compared to the perennial show of classlessness we see by hundreds - maybe even thousands of ISU fans - from their crude chants that have even provoked action by your own administration to spitting and hurling items at visiting fans that I have personally witnessed and I know Da Coach has as well.
You have never seen anything of the kind when you guys visit Bradley, and I am certain you'll even admit that.

http://bradleyfans.com/vb/showthread.php?t=6945

This is an argument that ISU fans will always lose as evidenced by the admissions of your own people...

[Nacho]

I have generally had okay experiences at Carver, but I have also been cussed out before, durning and after games there too...

And is FUBU really any different the I Screwed UP? I have seen that sign at every bu game I have been to, and it's been on the jumbotran as well.

It's a rivalry- s*** happens. Get over it

[tornado]

http://www.videtteonline.com/index.php?id=31327:gestures-spark-debate-of-rivalry-appropriateness&option=com_content&catid=35:newscampus&Itemid=53

I have nothing to get over - except to have to apologize to MY guests who accompanied me when attending a game at Redbird Arena because they were spit on by ISU fans...
I honestly have never expected the behavior to be any better - even tho on occasion it has been...

[Buesch N Chips]

About as classy as Egolf's foul on Carmichael right? hmmmm... lets see... what is more worse, a chant, or an intentional foul that could injure one of the best players in the league... hmmmmm Now I realize Egolf did not intend to injure Jackie, but his actions still could have caused an injury...

The chant is worse than that foul was. In my opinion.

[Nacho]

The chant is worse than that foul was. In my opinion.

Agree to disagree I suppose- but no point in arguing about it- it's not like either of our minds will be changed... gotta love a good rivalry!