Bradley is 5th Most Improved Team in the Country

[Gary the Gargoyle]

Works both ways.

Of course it does. My comment was in no way intended to imply that it's a one way street.

I often catch myself posting something and then deleting it moments later after giving consideration how it reads and what someone else may think it implies. I also try to avoid being a message board contrarian, waiting around for folks to post something, so that I can immediately opine the opposite.

Generally speaking, some folks seem to be ok with treating others poorly because of the anonymity that goes along with posting on a message board. I'm a little ashamed that I have gotten caught up in those types of battles myself. I know who a handful of the folks are here, and see some of them prior to every game. I wouldn't approach them in person and take the tone that I have taken on occasion on this message board, and I'd like to think they wouldn't with me either. So, this isn't my "can't we all just get along" speech, but my commitment to not being a part of the problem and what bogs these message boards down.

[LittleBrave]

postscript: just to provide an example of what I'm talking about, here's an example interchange:

BF poster: "Les had 4 straight 20 win seasons! Can't fire him for performance after one down year"
TOB poster: "Those wins came because of new postseason tournaments that didn't exist before, not an accurate comparison to other eras, etc etc"
BF poster: "You're slamming Les! He's much better than you're saying"
TOB poster: "No, I'm just trying to put the numbers in perspective relative to opportunity"
BF posters: "20 win seasons!"
TOB posters: "Are you even acknowledging my counter-point?"
BF poster: "Ban"

TAS, I usually think highly of your posts, and while this one had me cracking up near the end, this is a bit extreme, and not how things go down. It's kind of your interpretation blown up...though it is somewhat in line with the perception that people on here are over-defensive of their stance...on BOTH sides.
I tend to disagree with the pro-Les side and it's evident that they can't let any comment go that hints at the previous regime's shortcomings, but both sides have been anti-whatever to some degree, so it's not that one-sided as you depicted above.

I feel many times like the regular BU civilians are trying to overthrow the mods to gain control, and the mods are trying not to get their judgments stepped on. No matter what Geno does in his tenure, one side is not going to see the other side because each is unrelenting in their pursuit to be right!

And for the record, I have not had any of my posts deleted, though I'll admit a few have been borderline "deleteable". I'm really not sure what a deleted post looks like, but it must be pretty harsh or out of line...

IMO, the mods let a lot of things go and are "letting us play", though some fouls may be questionable (as in all sports), but overall they call a pretty clean game.

[TheAsianSensation]

TAS, you are usually reasonable, but your last post is absurd. Nobody here has ever been banned for expressing their opinions, or making points in a civil manner. And to suggest there weren't many posters who were anti-Jim Les is almost as absurd. I still hear from people regularly who 2 years later are attacking Jim Les, and wishing him ill will. There are losers who dedicate tremendous amounts of time to creating websites to continue their attacks on JL, because they aren't allowed to do it here.

Your characterization of the kinds of attacks on the previous coach, and players is extremely minimized. There were many uncalled for personal attacks that went beyond the rules of this board. But the main reason a few were banned was because they wanted to use this forum as their own personal bully pulpit to vent their hostility to get the coach fired, or to personally attack other posters who did not share their point of view. Some of those posters have returned and are still frequent posters here, others continue to take their shots, or like the cowardly juveniles that they are (see aggiefan), keep trying to surreptitiously sneak back and sabotage this board or resume their old attacks.

aggiefan isn't the first or only phony signup to try to return and bash Jim Les. There have been many that were blocked from registering, some of them numerous times.

Let me know if this is better suited in PM but in the interest of disclosure,...

I've seen many people say otherwise, that they've been banned for providing a different opinion. If it were just a couple people I'd be fine not believing them, but there seemed to be quite a number of them over there.

As far as wishing ill will on JL at UC-D, I honestly haven't seen anyone do that as of yet. I've seen people criticize his coaching in general, his record so far at UC-D, but every single person hopes he does well there. I've never heard anyone say they want him to fail. Note that this is different than pointing out if they think he's failing or not so far over there. Big difference between saying they don't want him to get the job done and saying they think he isn't getting the job done.

As for personal attacks on other posters who didn't share their opinion. I do agree towards a couple of posters, it got personal. But you're acting like only one side got personal with the arguments. I think the responsibility on that is shared equally, at least. We can argue if we want to which side is more responsible, but I don't see how both sides don't have some blame to go around.

As for "they wanted to use this forum as their own personal bully pulpit to vent their hostility to get the coach fired," I think this is an overcharacterization. They may have thought the best move was to get him fired, but that was knowing they had very little say in the big scheme of things. And I never saw them bully anyone. If anything, I think the other side were the bullies. Part of that was because the people with the money and the power on this forum were on the other side, of course. I saw both sides start reasonable arguments, but only one side was willing to listen and offer counter-arguments. Only one side decided to try and start a dialogue. The other side chose to ignore and yell louder.

Now I'm on the record saying aggiefan was uncalled for. There's twitter accounts out there that are completely uncalled for. Some fans there have indeed gone too far. I feel pretty much all of your recent mod decisions have been well made, to be honest. And there's been activity on TOB recently directed at a particular named poster that kind of disgusts me.

And finally, for the "tremendous amount of time" dedicated to this....honestly it doesn't take a lot of time. This long exhaustive post is taking, maybe, 5 minutes. I think you're underestimating the efficiency of today's youth around the internets.

[tornado]

... There's twitter accounts out there that are completely uncalled for. Some fans there have indeed gone too far....

but haven't you personally been involved in discussions and threads where really vicious, name calling, hateful attacks, and even calls for physical violence against people with whom they disagree - were the norm?
You simply never see anything like that or even remotely similar among fans on BF.com or among the large pct of Bradley fans...
Those are the fringe "fans" da coach refers to who troll here

[TheAsianSensation]

but haven't you personally been involved in discussions and threads where really vicious, name calling, hateful attacks, and even calls for physical violence against people with whom they disagree - were the norm?
You simply never see anything like that or even remotely similar among fans on BF.com or among the large pct of Bradley fans...
Those are the fringe "fans" da coach refers to who troll here

First off, DC actually does a good job of removing those here. From both sides.

I have been personally involved in such threads. Usually I'm the one pointing out their hypocrisy. I'm the one trying to get them to tone down. If they're reading this post, I ask them to post there and tell me if this is a correct assessment or not. While I criticize over there, I always avoid personal attacks. (I did believe I said once something about punching you as a joke, which is regrettable.)

[tornado]

I will leave it at that as I know you are reasonable and do not blame you in any way for the attacks of others - but on a message board that no longer exists, due largely to such attacks, there were calls to "take out", "clothesline", and physically harm certain people by name just out of a disagreement between fans??
Those same fans have tried endlessly to sabotage this board.
Can you see how absurd one extreme is that does NOT have any such counterpart on the other end?
If people let simple opinions get that much under their skin - they need to read something else.

[LittleBrave]

And finally, for the "tremendous amount of time" dedicated to this....honestly it doesn't take a lot of time. This long exhaustive post is taking, maybe, 5 minutes. I think you're underestimating the efficiency of today's youth around the internets.

Maybe you should spend a little more than 5 minutes on your posts to weed out some parts that are not appropriate rather than rattling along all your thoughts. Your post has me irked truthfully, and feel you should have better judgment of PMing this instead of throwing somebody under the bus for everyone to see.

This backs up my point that the mods let things fly and it would take a lot for something to get deleted...let alone a ban from the board. Yeah, I get ticked at T's comments from time to time, but you don't absolutely know his motives like you think you do, and certainly shouldn't judge them to the extent you did.

Hey - I'm gonna be upfront - if you don't like what's going on here, get on another ship or build one of your own.

[TheAsianSensation]

Then perhaps I will. This discussion is no longer healthy. I'll cop to that.

Unlike other people who are gone, I'm going to try and show better judgment before it gets ugly. Good luck with this site.

[LittleBrave]

Unlike other people who are gone, I'm going to try and show better judgment before it gets ugly. Good luck with this site.

Good to know...but it GOT ugly because of your judgment.

I don't remember seeing any posts like this from you TAS - only reason to leave is if you feel your comments are counter-productive and they are vendictive, as they most always are the opposite.

[ph]

Wow,
This is about as fun as a CNN vs FoxNews debate.
Those always end poorly because they always end up with people on both sides that refuse to recognize their own side is biased.
Of course your view of an issue is biased, that's why people have differences. And of course, its uncomfortable hearing something presented from the opposite view.

[Da Coach]

The most amazing part of this is-every one of us has the freedom to visit and participate in any site on the internet. At last count there were believed to be billions of websites. And I don't like or don't care to be a part of 99.999% of them. But I don' t repeatedly go to them and try to sabotage, troll, change, call out, or shout down everyone I don't agree with or don't like. I just stay away and ignore them.
But that is not the case with this site's detractors. They continuously try all those things and more in an irrational attempt to shut down anyone they don't agree with or lob verbal attacks from afar. They are the irrational ones and that kind of juvenile behavior will never be allowed here.
We welcome the true fans that are here because of a true and passionate interest in supporting Bradley.

[Bravesfan]

The other board is not anti-JL, for the millionth time. It's anti bradleyfans, and the problem is the only way to show that is to disagree about this board's overall opinion of JL.

Of course, that board DOES have some problems.

Well I'd rather be on this board that allows both sides of the argument (as tiring as it may be for some people) than to have an anti-JL board. And if it isn't anti-JL and is more anti-bradleyfans, that's 100 times worse because that's a direct shot on the current coaching regime, the players who are great people giving all they can on the court and in the classroom, and the legitimate die-hard Bradley fans that have supported this team for decades, through good times and bad. That to me creates more poison than a few of the same "pro/anti" JL arguments that come up here from time to time, which is actually a very small percentage of the time compared to the wealth of Bradley information anyone can get here. Glad DC does a great job keeping things civil around here!

[Buesch N Chips]

The most amazing part of this is-every one of us has the freedom to visit and participate in any site on the internet. At last count there were believed to be billions of websites. And I don't like or don't care to be a part of 99.999% of them. But I don' t repeatedly go to them and try to sabotage, troll, change, call out, or shout down everyone I don't agree with or don't like. I just stay away and ignore them.
But that is not the case with this site's detractors. They continuously try all those things and more in an irrational attempt to shut down anyone they don't agree with or lob verbal attacks from afar. They are the irrational ones and that kind of juvenile behavior will never be allowed here.

Amen!

[Bravesfan]

We all seem to see things through different lenses, mostly effected by our biases (both good and bad). I'm always most surprised by those who are so married to their own opinion that they couldn't possibly see the situation any other way.

Yes, but the anti-Les people are just as married to that opinion as the pro-Les people are. I don't see anything wrong with that. Besides, you can't change everyone's opinion either.

[Old Coach]

Yes, but the anti-Les people are just as married to that opinion as the pro-Les people are. I don't see anything wrong with that. Besides, you can't change everyone's opinion either.

I don't think it was implied that anyone should change his opinion, but that consideration of the opinions of others could be given more civil treatment (by both sides of the issue).