I took the "survey" last night. I did not like any of their choices for the mascot. I suggested the Bradley Bison, but I believe our future "mascot" has been selected. I stated that it seems that a lot of time, energy, and money has been spent on an issue that I believe is not as important as other issues.
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Bradley branding and mascot
- Thread starter Biff
- Start date
Gary the Gargoyle
New member
Bison isn't bad. I like the alliteration.
Ew, the only Bison I know is the Colorado Buffalo. And the Bills. Not exactly what you call "branding" haha
If you would be interested in keeping this tradition with the Brave and we could do it, PM me and if people can get some gear together I might show up to some of the games in it. It would do my Dad and Grandpa proud.
Imagine if ALL the teams in Chicago.... or professional sports were known without Logos/Mascots/Nicknames. How would that go over for branding? Shirts that read "Chicago Football". "North Side Baseball Club". "South Side Baseball Club". "Chicago Hockey". "Chicago Soccer". Is that good for marketing, branding, or generating a solid fan-base with tradition?
Future Walk-On
New member
give us a gargoyle mascot named "Giant who eats Bear and lives where white smoke rises"
that will definitely appease the NCAA
that will definitely appease the NCAA
Braves4Life
New member
Sweeeeeeet! :lol:
I too received the email survey and am definitely providing an opinion. I know it has been discussed here pretty thorougly, but I have yet to hear solid information as to why, after several years of being allowed to keep a decades old name, it is apparently being decided to change. Who, and I emphasize "who" is driving this and why? Universities and collegiate sports do well to focus and promote and market tradition, these apparent moves fly in the face of that. To destroy a focal point of university and community pride for a marketing gimmick is ill-conceived. As has been said before, simply produce quality winning teams and gear will sell and donations will come in. A transparent effort to put lipstick on a pig is not the way to go. Who is wanting this?
Everyone should be asking this question. But we are not going to get an open answer. I encourage everyone to privately ask as many people with connections to Bradley as you can, and you will probably get your answer.
Personally, I feel strongly that Bradley needs to keep the name Braves.
I really don't want to have to change the subtitle on the top banner of every page!
SpfldBUAlum
New member
ONe question I recall from the survery asked about how a change away from Braves would effect your financial support of Bradley. Would love to see the final results on that compared to the final decision.
Future Walk-On
New member
Can anyone tell me what year our name "officially" became the braves?
This is being lead by liberal minded admins who just got here and want to change the whole school. :roll:
This is being lead by liberal minded admins who just got here and want to change the whole school. :roll:
Former BU Pres. Broski said it was 1937
http://www.bradleybraves.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=3400&ATCLID=271847
I think our nickname is important. I know everyone gets sick of BCS comparisons, but Big 10 and SEC nicknames go back to the early 1900's in most cases.
LSU: Our nickname goes back to the civil war
BU: We got our nickname from surveys and focus groups
My opinion: I don't want to change our nickname for the sake of changing our nickname. Lions and Eagles are overdone, unless there is a special connection somewhere that I don't see BU having. Gargoyles aren't unique enough to BU or enough of a part of Bradley's history to warrant the nickname. Maybe people talk about gargoyles and I just haven't heard it outside of BU stories in the alumni newsletters.
Accountability, Courage, Diligence, Integrity, Respect, Tradition, Victory, Honor, Glory, Excellence. All values I think most could agree with. I have no idea which of those a gargoyle represents.
LSU: Our nickname goes back to the civil war
BU: We got our nickname from surveys and focus groups
My opinion: I don't want to change our nickname for the sake of changing our nickname. Lions and Eagles are overdone, unless there is a special connection somewhere that I don't see BU having. Gargoyles aren't unique enough to BU or enough of a part of Bradley's history to warrant the nickname. Maybe people talk about gargoyles and I just haven't heard it outside of BU stories in the alumni newsletters.
Accountability, Courage, Diligence, Integrity, Respect, Tradition, Victory, Honor, Glory, Excellence. All values I think most could agree with. I have no idea which of those a gargoyle represents.
Gary the Gargoyle
New member
Although Bradley won the right to maintain the name Braves, others changed when the NCAA pressured them and it didn't seem to negatively affect the identity of those universities. The example that always comes to mind for me is Marquette moving from Warriors to Golden Eagles.
For the record, I wouldn't change it, but I wanted to point out that others did, and they seem to be doing just fine.
For the record, I wouldn't change it, but I wanted to point out that others did, and they seem to be doing just fine.
For the record- Marquette did see a backlash when their name change was imposed, and many of their alumni and supporters still hold their grudges. There were alumni who claimed they would stop or cut back their donations. We'll never know how much, if any, that might have happened, since Marquette is a private institution, and does not report such things publically. But I know a couple Marquette alumni who refuse to donate because of this. It has probably cost them millions.
Here is more evidence the name change did hurt them, and may still be hurting them. Ten years after the change, a high ranking member of the board of trustees of Marquette University (the vice chairman) spoke at their graduation ceremony, and he promised that he and another member of the board of trustees would each donate $1 million apiece if Marquette would change back to the Warriors.
http://www.thebatt.com/2.8485/marquette-offered-2-million-to-change-name-back-to-warriors-1.1205164
Here is another article reporting that some prominent alumni still refuse to donate because of the name change.
http://thewarrior.org/2010/11/10/jump-around/
Students still chant Warriors at their games, and unauthorized and unofficial Marquette Warriors t-shirts and apparel are still widely available and are big sellers (though the university gets nothing from this).
So after 18 years, there is still animosity and lost revenue because of Marquette's name change, and similar things have happened at St. Johns, and other schools. Can Bradley afford this kind of backlash, and long lasting animosity?
tornado
New member
wow - just a crude estimate would easily place the total figure that Marquette has LOST due to the change from Warriors has to be in the five to tens of millions of $$!
Ten years ago UMass proposed changing their mascot & logo from the Minutemen (and Minutewomen - believe it or not) to the Grey Wolves -
They hired research firms, did surveys, and tried out other possible replacements....the backlash was SUFFICIENT to override the University's move...
Here's a description of basically what the school said at the time...
"..the Minuteman is white, male, and carries a rifle for purposes of shooting
other humans, which makes him the iconic representation of the worst that
America has to offer.... Worse, this white male potential-murderer is actually
held up as a positive symbol, someone to be admired."
Here's just one page of message board posts & note how many people have passionate objections and are really angry about any change!
http://umasshoops.com/news/2003-04/mascot_idea_comments20030508.htm
..note the guy who says he, like MANY OTHERS, will QUIT giving and donating if they make the change....
"Keep the Minuteman. If not, add me to the list of former donors and fans"
Even to this day - the UMass people refer to the 2003 thing as the "Grey Wolf fiasco" -
http://maroonmusket.com/2012/05/new-lids-how-should-umass-change-its-look/
BTW - Sports Illustrated did their own research and surveys a few years back - one thing they found was that 87% of Native Americans did NOT object to sports teams using Native American imagery -- and the percentage that strongly objected was well down in single digits.
Ten years ago UMass proposed changing their mascot & logo from the Minutemen (and Minutewomen - believe it or not) to the Grey Wolves -
They hired research firms, did surveys, and tried out other possible replacements....the backlash was SUFFICIENT to override the University's move...
Here's a description of basically what the school said at the time...
"..the Minuteman is white, male, and carries a rifle for purposes of shooting
other humans, which makes him the iconic representation of the worst that
America has to offer.... Worse, this white male potential-murderer is actually
held up as a positive symbol, someone to be admired."
Here's just one page of message board posts & note how many people have passionate objections and are really angry about any change!
http://umasshoops.com/news/2003-04/mascot_idea_comments20030508.htm
..note the guy who says he, like MANY OTHERS, will QUIT giving and donating if they make the change....
"Keep the Minuteman. If not, add me to the list of former donors and fans"
Even to this day - the UMass people refer to the 2003 thing as the "Grey Wolf fiasco" -
http://maroonmusket.com/2012/05/new-lids-how-should-umass-change-its-look/
BTW - Sports Illustrated did their own research and surveys a few years back - one thing they found was that 87% of Native Americans did NOT object to sports teams using Native American imagery -- and the percentage that strongly objected was well down in single digits.
tornado
New member
Wow- here's another example that just blows me away...
At University of North Dakota - a donor named Ralph Engelstad was willing to give a $100 MILLION donation but only if their "Fighting Sioux" nickname was retained!!!
This may well consitute one of the largest single donations ever given to any school in all of history...
He specified he'd give the money only...
"under the condition that the
Fighting Sioux name and logo were retained."
http://www.theralph.com/the-ralph/the-new-ralph
now that they are retiring the nickname it will almost surely cost the school MILLIONS...the issue is still not entirely resolved...
http://www.und.edu/org/bridges/dearchuck.html
Ralph writes....
"As I am sure you realize, the commitment I made to the university of North Dakota was,
I believe, one of the 10 largest ever made to a school of higher education, but if it is not completed,
I am sure it will be the number one building never brought to completion at a school of higher education,
due to your changing the logo and the slogan.
You need to think how changing this logo and slogan will affect not just the few that are urging the name change,
but also how it will affect the university as a while, the students, the city of Grand forks, and the state of North Dakota.
If the logo and slogan are not approved by the above-mentioned date, I will then write a letter on December 30, 2000,
to all contractors and to everybody associated with the arena, canceling their construction contracts for the completion of the arena."
He kept his word - his (and his foundation's - now that he has passed away) donations were cancelled and thus the school lost $65 MILLION!!!
At University of North Dakota - a donor named Ralph Engelstad was willing to give a $100 MILLION donation but only if their "Fighting Sioux" nickname was retained!!!
This may well consitute one of the largest single donations ever given to any school in all of history...
He specified he'd give the money only...
"under the condition that the
Fighting Sioux name and logo were retained."
http://www.theralph.com/the-ralph/the-new-ralph
now that they are retiring the nickname it will almost surely cost the school MILLIONS...the issue is still not entirely resolved...
http://www.und.edu/org/bridges/dearchuck.html
Ralph writes....
"As I am sure you realize, the commitment I made to the university of North Dakota was,
I believe, one of the 10 largest ever made to a school of higher education, but if it is not completed,
I am sure it will be the number one building never brought to completion at a school of higher education,
due to your changing the logo and the slogan.
You need to think how changing this logo and slogan will affect not just the few that are urging the name change,
but also how it will affect the university as a while, the students, the city of Grand forks, and the state of North Dakota.
If the logo and slogan are not approved by the above-mentioned date, I will then write a letter on December 30, 2000,
to all contractors and to everybody associated with the arena, canceling their construction contracts for the completion of the arena."
He kept his word - his (and his foundation's - now that he has passed away) donations were cancelled and thus the school lost $65 MILLION!!!
Bradley branding & Mascot
Bradley branding & Mascot
Changing the name "Braves" to anything else would be super dumb. Doing this would cost the University $$, erode whatever fan base remains, damage the Bradley image nationally since we are known across the USA as the "Braves", and anger most alumni. I would implore the ill-advised BU people who are pushing these changes to leave things alone---You are hurting our school.
If you want to help, work hard to rebuild the mens B. Ball program back to a national power. Winning can solve most of our image/reputation problems. Butler, Gonzaga, Xavier, Creighton, et al are the role models for where we need to go and what we want to be. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
Bradley branding & Mascot
Changing the name "Braves" to anything else would be super dumb. Doing this would cost the University $$, erode whatever fan base remains, damage the Bradley image nationally since we are known across the USA as the "Braves", and anger most alumni. I would implore the ill-advised BU people who are pushing these changes to leave things alone---You are hurting our school.
If you want to help, work hard to rebuild the mens B. Ball program back to a national power. Winning can solve most of our image/reputation problems. Butler, Gonzaga, Xavier, Creighton, et al are the role models for where we need to go and what we want to be. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
Is it impossible to have the nickname "BRAVES" and have a Gargoyle as our mascot?
FWIW - my grandfather and father have told lots of stories of their time on campus and those gargoyles. Something about them whistling every time virgin co-eds would pass beneath them.
There was even a story about them either fighting the 1963 fire (or starting it...I can't remember which). Been a while since I heard that one.
Wonder if any of our elder alums can remember any of those stories or if there is any other "lore" that would help to tie them to campus even further.
FWIW - my grandfather and father have told lots of stories of their time on campus and those gargoyles. Something about them whistling every time virgin co-eds would pass beneath them.
There was even a story about them either fighting the 1963 fire (or starting it...I can't remember which). Been a while since I heard that one.
Wonder if any of our elder alums can remember any of those stories or if there is any other "lore" that would help to tie them to campus even further.
That's what I'M saying! Though as we're told in the video, that's a no-no because "Braves" only has one definition in the dictionary.... *sigh*
I guess I am one of those elder alums... I have never heard any these stories, but that doesn't mean they aren't true.
I was just wondering why the Gargoyles never whistle any more? :twisted: