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Butler is in the drivers seat but I guarantee they have a plan in place for different outcomes. I just do not see the Horizon or the MVC for that fact being relevant in 5 years. The Big East will implode and the dynamo effect will be felt nationally. St. John, Georgetown and Villanova will be in the market to form a basketball only conference which will demand a nice media package. Butler will see the writing on the wall and bail out of the Horizon.
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"Educate and inform the whole mass of the people...they are the only sure reliance for the preservation of our liberty."
??” Thomas Jefferson
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Also, In my lifetime at leastOriginally posted by tornado View Post
Peoria to Las Cruces, NM-----1338 miles
Peoria to Amarillo, TX--------926 miles
...these crazy conference affiliations are not new or historically unusual at all. They are as old as say...The Missouri Valley Conference
BTW...I would love to have an excuse to goto Colorado Springs to see a game!Get Well Massive Mike! "Once a Brave always a Brave!"Comment
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Referencing earlier talk, looks like Oral Bob to the Southland is on the brink:
Again, there's big geographical benefit to this move.
This is a pure speculation call by me, but I'm wondering if ORU waited until Elgin put the kibosh on expansion a couple of weeks ago before finalizing any Southland deal. It would've been in their best interests to make a couple calls to Air Force to see if they could be a western package deal for the MVC.Comment
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From the Tulsa World a few weeks ago-
ORU confirms talks with Southland Conference
I am surprised if ORU is really looking to ditch the Summit, in this case for the Southland Conference?
Other than less travel, IMO the Southland Conference is a major step down for ORU.
The Southland Conference is a mix of 12 weakling directional schools in Texas, Arkansas, and Louisiana. Every one of the current 12 schools in the Southland Conference is a public state school (ORU would be the only private school if they joined them), most of which play football (which ORU does not). ORU just doesn't fit in the Southland. If they joined they would be the only school not in Texas, Arkansas, or Louisiana (so there would still be a lot of travel involved). They would be the only private school. They would be one of only 2 schools (the other is TAMU-CC) that does not play football. And they would be joining a much weaker basketball league. And they would be joining a bunch of schools with no natural rivalries.
The Southland Conference is one of the worst basketball conferences in the country. True, the Summit isn't exactly a basketball power conference, but they did rank 21st in conference RPI last year. However, the Southland was 29th out of 31 conferences! And the Summit is getting stronger and adding schools that improve them, while the Southland is losing 3 of their stronger schools this year and getting weaker.
ORU would be smarter to wait, and IMO it would probably have the chance to join a better conference like the Conference USA which has better natural rivalries.Comment
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This is almost entirely about travel to me.
Summit League map:
Southland map:
There's still a little bit of travel, but going to the Southland means trips to Arkansas, Louisiana, and Texas. Right now they're going to Utah, Indiana, and Michigan among other places. It's a significant saving in travel costs for all sports. I don't think that part can be overestimated. Also there's no rivals for them in the S'land, but there isn't exactly a natural one in the Summit for them. And Texas exposure is probably a net plus.
I don't expect the Southland to be done expanding either. They lost some bodies to the WAC so they may have other plans.
As for the basketball product, it's a small step down. Not significant, but small. Most years, the leagues are roughly synonymous. The difference is that it's usually easier for a team in the Summit to dominate - no one has really broken away from the pack year in and year out in the Southland. Most years they're pretty close to each other in RPI (I could only find kenpom rankings for previous years, but the conferences are usually within a couple of spots of each other). Last year was definitely a plus year for the Summit.
I'd like to think Oral Bob isn't done moving, but there's not much room out there for a non-football school to move on up. I actually think the WAC could be in play if they ever need another non-footy.Comment
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Travel issues never seem to be that important to other schools changing conferences. Look at the schools now joining the SECComment
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Yeah, well, the Summit League doesn't have a TV contract paying its members $17 million to travel all over the place.Originally posted by Da Coach View Post
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But by ORU joining the Southland, they don't seem to be gaining revenue anywhere. That is what makes this so unusual. We'll know at 2:30pm when they hold their press conference. But IMO they appear to be making a big mistake. I know the Summit isn't a major conference, but what kid wants to play in virtual obscurity in the Southland? And if you were an ORU ticket holder, would you get excited about these conference schools coming in for home games?
It looks a lot like ISU's home non-conference schedules the past few years!
Southland
East
Central Arkansas
Lamar
McNeese St.
Nicholls
Northwestern St.
SE Louisiana
West
Sam Houston St.
Stephen F. Austin
TAMU Corpus Christi
Texas St.
TX Arlington
UTSA
(The bottom 3 schools are leaving the Southland after this season)
The Tulsa World is reporting the move to the Southland is a done deal, but that there is a buyout clause-
I still think ORU would have been better served by waiting, as there will be openings in the CUSA, and other better conferences.
Conference realignment appears far from finished.
There are rumors of the Big East putting together a mega-conference with as many as 32 teams-
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It's right, they do gain no revenue, but they save travel costs, so a penny saved is a penny earned.
I wouldn't be surprised if ORU moves again in a year if something arises. It is a bit odd they're moving down when so many other programs are trying to move up.Comment
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In another move that is driven entirely by football, West Virginia now planning to leave the Big East for the Big 12-
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Big 12 puts a hold on expansion until Missouri decided what it's doingOriginally posted by Da Coach View Post
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Don't let them kid you, they want that Championship game again. But i don't think they want a superconference. Just 12.Originally posted by Da Coach View Post... At the end, of the storm, there's a golden sky. And the sweet silver song of the lark. Walk on, through the wind, walk on, through the rain, though your dreams be tossed, and blown. Walk on, Walk on with hope in your hearts, and you'll never walk alone!
I'm behind you 100% Bradley Braves, You'll Never Walk Alone! BEAT STATE!Comment
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This could get very ugly very quickly. There were reports that a Kentucky senator was in contact with the Oklahoma prez Boren trying to squeeze in Louisville, and that leads to this:
Politicians are starting to get involved.Comment
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Originally posted by Da Coach View PostBut by ORU joining the Southland, they don't seem to be gaining revenue anywhere. That is what makes this so unusual. We'll know at 2:30pm when they hold their press conference. But IMO they appear to be making a big mistake. I know the Summit isn't a major conference, but what kid wants to play in virtual obscurity in the Southland? And if you were an ORU ticket holder, would you get excited about these conference schools coming in for home games?
It looks a lot like ISU's home non-conference schedules the past few years!
Southland
East
Central Arkansas
Lamar
McNeese St.
Nicholls
Northwestern St.
SE Louisiana
West
Sam Houston St.
Stephen F. Austin
TAMU Corpus Christi
Texas St.
TX Arlington
UTSA
(The bottom 3 schools are leaving the Southland after this season)
The Tulsa World is reporting the move to the Southland is a done deal, but that there is a buyout clause-
I still think ORU would have been better served by waiting, as there will be openings in the CUSA, and other better conferences.
Conference realignment appears far from finished.
There are rumors of the Big East putting together a mega-conference with as many as 32 teams-
http://philly.sbnation.com/temple-ow...conference-usa
Well, the two teams I would be interested in would be Northwestern St. and Lamar. Northwestern St. did upset Iowa in the NCAA Tournament in 2007, proving once again that even teams in this conference are capable of wreaking havoc in the postseason.
And Lamar will be an interesting team to watch under first year head coach Pat Knight who for the most part failed in his time at Texas Tech. Of course Lamar also may be in some trouble with the NCAA as the NCAA is accusing Bob Knight of illegally talking to a couple of players Pat was recruiting.
Aside from that though, I do agree DC that this is a step down for ORU, even from the Summit conference. As you said, what better situation would there be for ORU than waiting for a possible opening in CUSA, especially since they would strenghten their rivalry with Tulsa. Plus ORU has proven they can compete with high level teams, and I think CUSA provides competition for ORU more at their level. If they desire to be the next Gonzaga or Butler, they have to show they can compete with at least the top half of Division I.
Oh, and I'm still laughing (though maybe not for long) at the thought of a 32 team Big East. What a logistical nightmare that would be!Comment
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It's being reported that the Big 12 schools have voted to accept just West Virginia for now.Originally posted by TheAsianSensation View PostThis could get very ugly very quickly. There were reports that a Kentucky senator was in contact with the Oklahoma prez Boren trying to squeeze in Louisville, and that leads to this:
Politicians are starting to get involved.
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