Henricksen's final look @ 2011

[45otseoj]

http://blogs.suntimes.com/hoopsreport/2011/05/by_joe_henricksen_the_anthony.html

1. Anthony Davis, 6-10, PF, Chicago (Perspectives)
-Kentucky
2. Wayne Blackshear, 6-5, WF, Chicago (Morgan Park)
-Louisville
3. Nnanna Egwu, 6-10, C, Chicago (St. Ignatius)
-Illinois
4. Mycheal Henry, 6-6, WF, Chicago (Orr)
-Illinois
5. Ryan Boatright, 5-11, PG, Aurora (East)
-UConn
6. Chasson Randle, 6-2, PG/2G, Rock Island
-Stanford
7. Sam Thompson, 6-6, WF, Chicago (Whitney Young)
-Ohio State
8. Tracy Abrams, 6-0, PG, Chicago (Mt. Carmel)
-Illinois
9. Abdel Nader, 6-7, PF, Skokie (Niles North)
-Northern Illinois
10. David Sobolewski, 6-1, PG, Lisle (Benet Academy)
-Northwestern
11. Frank Kaminsky, 6-10, PF/C, Lisle (Benet Academy)
-Wisconsin
12. Mike Shaw, 6-8, PF, Chicago (De La Salle)
-Illinois
13. Johnny Hill, 6-3, 2G, Lombard (Glenbard East)
-Illinois State
14. Bruce Baron, 6-3, PG, Carbondale (Brehm Prep)
-Oregon
15. George Marshall, 6-0, PG, Chicago (Brooks)
-Wisconsin
16. Jamee Crockett, 6-4, WF, Crete-Monee
-DePaul
17. Dre Henley, 6-6, WF, Chicago (De La Salle)
-Northern Illinois
18. Quenton Chievous, 6-4, WF, Niles (Notre Dame)
-Tennessee
19. James Farr, 6-8, PF, Evanston
-Prep school --> Xavier
20. Roosevelt Jones, 6-3, WF, O'Fallon
-Butler
22. Max Bielfeldt, 6-7, PF, Peoria (Notre Dame)
-Michigan
28. Nick Zeisloft, 6-4, 2G, LaGrange (Lyons Twp.)
-Illinois State
29. Ryan Sawvell, 6-7, PF, Mundelein
-Evansville
33. Donivine Stewart, 5-10, PG, Bartonville (Limestone)
-Bradley
36. Mike Turner, 6-7, PF, Chicago (University)
-Northwestern
39. Jordan Nelson, 5-11, PG/2G, Lincoln
-Evansville

[Da Coach]

Nice to see him put a whopping 6 players out of 40 who were not from the Chicago area.

I think Joe Henricksen is great at following high school basketball and I really like his stuff. But he doesn't get out of the Chicago area very much, and sometimes he buys into hype regarding some players.
Here are Henricksen's "Final" lists from the previous 2 years. The 2010 list is a little harder to evaluate, since many of the players haven't had time to prove themselves, and many redshirted, But from his 2009 list, it is obvious he is wrong as often as he is right-

2010-

http://blogs.suntimes.com/hoopsreport/2010/04/richmond_leonard_top_2010.html

2009-

http://blogs.suntimes.com/hoopsreport/2009/04/final_look_at_the_class_of_200.html

And here is an article from Sept. 2007 titled "Jankovich, ISU got it right", where he congratulates Jankovich for such recruiting steals as Jeremy Robinson, Keyon Smith, and Sead Odzic.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/hoopsreport/2007/09/jankovich_isu_got_it_right.html#more

[45otseoj]

Nice to see him put a whopping 6 players out of 40 who were not from the Chicago area.

Who else from downstate would you have had instead?

Here is a list of the D-I commits not from the Chicagoland area...

Emmanuel Ochenje, 6-9, C, Carbondale (Brehm Prep): Chattanooga
Hayden Hoerdemann, 6-3, SG, Bloomington (Central Catholic): Western Michigan
Kyle Anderson, 6-2, SG, Newark Community: Deleware
Charles Joy, 6-4, SF, O'Fallon: SIU-Edwardsville
Josh Piper, 6-8, PF, Champaign (Centennial): Eastern Illinois
Aaron Adeoye, 6-6, PF, Marion: Ball State

[tornado]

there are a couple very talented downstate kids who virtually carried their teams on their backs like Max & DS -- but they get ranked in the 20-30's..
then there are also a couple Chicago area kids who kinda fell off the map with weak senior seasons -- but they stayed well above the downstate kids ..

this is no knock on anyone but...here's just one example...there are others...

-Tracy Abrams definitely struggled at times, some Illini fans even expressing they think they made a mistake offering him so early -- his averages weren't exactly eyepopping considering DS beat him in every category and Max virtually doubled his scoring, and even all the major ranking services dropped him over the course of his senior year ...and he made 2nd Team All State via IBCA - same as Max & Donivine.

[45otseoj]

Hey t. You've mentioned to me how impressed you were with Johnny Hill at the State tournament. How high would you have ranked him? Is he a player you would have liked to see at BU?

[tornado]

yes -- he's top 12-15 -- based on talent and athleticism...
but I think the reason he didn't get more recruiting attention is common for players of his type --
he is a fairly slender 6-3 slasher -- and gets only about 15% of his scoring on 3-pointers....so quite possibly recruiters have their concerns about scoring at the D-I level where few 6-3 kids get many close looks at the basket - unlike high school.
He did shoot well in the semi's and 3rd place game but was clearly not abn accomplished ball handler as will be required at the next level --

[45otseoj]

yes -- he's top 12-15 -- based on talent and athleticism...
but I think the reason he didn't get more recruiting attention is common for players of his type --
he is a fairly slender 6-3 slasher -- and gets only about 15% of his scoring on 3-pointers....so quite possibly recruiters have their concerns about scoring at the D-I level where few 6-3 kids get many close looks at the basket - unlike high school.
He did shoot well in the semi's and 3rd place game but was clearly not abn accomplished ball handler as will be required at the next level --

That's a good point, but 2 things should also be noted:
1) His 3pt% was around 40% during the State tournament.
2) He rarely had to settle for outside shots, because he got to the rim as he pleased.

I'll admit that ISU was lucky to land him when they did. When you look at the company he keeps on the Chicago Tribune 2nd Team All-State team, it would not be hard to imagine him signing on with a BCS school if he would have taken his time with the recruiting process.

The way you describe his game is very similar to what I saw out of Lemon last season. For ISU's sake, I hope he can produce in the same way. It will be hard for him to find minutes though. I don't think a redshirt is out of the question.

[tornado]

..similar to what I saw out of Lemon last season. ....

yes - I would agree -- but BU has looked at a lot of similar players the past few years and passed on most of them...
the most recent was the juco kid who then signed with SIU -- Jeff Early -- a very athletic, above-the-rim kid who got to the hoop -- but who didn't have much ball handling skills or outside shooting skills...thus he's gonna struggle at the MVC-level -- and heaven knows as an example -- SIU already has had a ton of 6-1 to 6-3 2-guards over the past couple years (Bocot, Cleveland, Crowder, Long, Taylor, Freeman, Hare, Roundtree..) who can only score when they are open in the paint -- but guess what -- it simply won't happen much in the Valley...thus SIU struggles to put 50-60 on the board.

And I don't want to start an argument - but ISU is about the same --
Half the roster are 2-guards (Blue, Clark, Coates, Hill, Rubin, and even JW is used and listed as a 2-guard) and yet they have trouble knowing where the scoring is coming from - and hit only 31% on THREES.

[45otseoj]

None of this is argumentative. It's the off season, and this board is one of the few places that will actually have a discussion about what goes on on the court. I hope none of this is taken in that way.

yes - I would agree -- but BU has looked at a lot of similar players the past few years and passed on most of them...

I gurantee any Valley coach would take Johnny Hill after the way he played in March. 2nd team All-State and dropped 22 on one of the best teams in the nation while only taking 11 shots AND giving them their biggest scare of the post-season.

And BU passed on Hill? Your assistant was writing on his facebook wall 2 days before he committed to ISU. You didn't pass. You were just waiting to see if he would improve (which he did) before you offered. He's a high risk/reward prospect because of his frame (just like Moore). If he didn't improve over his senior year I would be a bit leary, but he did in almost every facet of his game. Now he just needs to put on some weight.

Jeff Early -- a very athletic, above-the-rim kid who got to the hoop -- but who didn't have much ball handling skills or outside shooting skills...thus he's gonna struggle at the MVC-level

That isn't necessarily true. DSE is a really bad outside shooter, but he managers to score a boatlad from the 2G position.

And I don't want to start an argument - but ISU is about the same

Don't worry. No person in their right mind would argue that ISU's guard play was any good.

[Da Coach]

Jeff Early -- a very athletic, above-the-rim kid who got to the hoop -- but who didn't have much ball handling skills or outside shooting skills...thus he's gonna struggle at the MVC-level...

That isn't necessarily true. DSE is a really bad outside shooter, but he managers to score a boatlad from the 2G position...

This comparison is not very accurate. DSE is a better shooter than Jeff Early is, and we'll see that next season when Early plays and struggles to score. Also, DSE has PG skills and can create his own shot. Early is a poor ball handler. A better comparison is that maybe Early could be a shorter version of Lawrence Wright.

[tornado]

A)- DSE did struggle to score until he learned some better ball handling skills and shot a bit better from outside (in the 2nd half of his soph season) forcing defenses to extend and cover him...suddenly he became a reliable double digit scorer....he is a perfect example and a lot of schools did pass on him...

B) I never said BU passed on Hill -- but there were reasons BU didn't target him as top option and I noted those...

C) Everything you have said about Hill has been said about several players who have struggled and who are now gone from the Valley -- I think my assessment is good -- I think Johnny Hill will give you what Austin Hill gave you -- worth keeping but not capable of boosting the team to first place.

Hill's 3pt shooting is better judged by how he did over 30 games not just two...let's start this discussion back up when Johny is hitting 40% from the arc..

but otseoj -- surely you recall we had virtually identical discussions a couple years ago about Justin Clark and Terrence Johnson...same for Sead Odzic....and all the ISU fans said those guys would fill it up and be prolific scorers ..
As a little reminder -- I looked at SO's, and Justin Clark's and TJ's long-term 3pt-pct and predicted what actually happended!!
That they'd struggle to hit the rim and would NOT be prolific scorers.

[45otseoj]

A)- DSE did struggle to score until he learned some better ball handling skills and shot a bit better from outside (in the 2nd half of his soph season) forcing defenses to extend and cover him...suddenly he became a reliable double digit scorer....he is a perfect example and a lot of schools did pass on him...

Illinois State didn't.

B) I never said BU passed on Hill -- but there were reasons BU didn't target him as top option and I noted those...

At the time he committed he was not much more than a mid-major recruit. But he is, without a doubt, a player you would have liked to see in a BU uniform. (or at least plenty of your fellow Braves would have)

C) Everything you have said about Hill has been said about several players who have struggled and who are now gone from the Valley -- I think my assessment is good -- I think Johnny Hill will give you what Austin Hill gave you -- worth keeping but not capable of boosting the team to first place.

Not disagreeing, just interested on who you are referencing.

Hill's 3pt shooting is better judged by how he did over 30 games not just two...let's start this discussion back up when Johny is hitting 40% from the arc..

I have no idea what his complete season 3pt% was. I saw him play 6 times and his % was 38%.

but otseoj -- surely you recall we had virtually identical discussions a couple years ago about Justin Clark and Terrence Johnson...same for Sead Odzic....and all the ISU fans said those guys would fill it up and be prolific scorers ..
As a little reminder -- I looked at SO's, and Justin Clark's and TJ's long-term 3pt-pct and predicted what actually happended!!
That they'd struggle to hit the rim and would NOT be prolific scorers.

I wasn't into this as much at that point, so I didn't follow the recruitment of those guys. I've often referenced your research when comparing this set of recruits to that set. This set is much better at perimeter shooting.
Moore and Zeisloft both shoot 40% and Hill and Brown shoot in the mid to upper 30% range. I'm sure that was a huge factor in the recruitment of these guys.

You've got to give Jank credit for one thing though. Moore, Hill, and Zeis all saw their stock rise during their senior year after they signed.

[Future Walk-On]

there are a couple very talented downstate kids who virtually carried their teams on their backs like Max & DS -- but they get ranked in the 20-30's..
then there are also a couple Chicago area kids who kinda fell off the map with weak senior seasons -- but they stayed well above the downstate kids ..

this is no knock on anyone but...here's just one example...there are others...

-Tracy Abrams definitely struggled at times, some Illini fans even expressing they think they made a mistake offering him so early -- his averages weren't exactly eyepopping considering DS beat him in every category and Max virtually doubled his scoring, and even all the major ranking services dropped him over the course of his senior year ...and he made 2nd Team All State via IBCA - same as Max & Donivine.

TA was also hurt his entire Junior year and part of his senior year... he played in an all star game on ESPN 3 with the likes of boatright and henry and was awesome

[tornado]

so we're back to being OK with allowing injuries as excuses, huh??

[Future Walk-On]

so we're back to being OK with allowing injuries as excuses, huh??

lol an excuse for why an individual doesn't succeed...or why a team doesn't