since when do you get a technical foul for yelling at your player to get up ?

[mrcoachdude]

Yeah, but they already had the ball.

So your using the argument that ISU wouldn't have scored except the tech gave them the momentum to score???

ISU had the ball already so all they gained was the 2 ft's.

I am not sure what your argueing about...ISU had the ball...JL got T'd and ISU made both FT's...then they have the ball awarded to them by rule...and make a basket...that is a 4 point swing...up 8 to up 4...in a period of a few seconds...that is all i said...

[lefty]

I am not sure what your argueing about...ISU had the ball...JL got T'd and ISU made both FT's...then they have the ball awarded to them by rule...and make a basket...that is a 4 point swing...up 8 to up 4...in a period of a few seconds...that is all i said...

the can't be a 4pt swing coach..there is no possession change on a technical...ISU could have scored anyway on their possesion without the T and it's a 6 pt game...

[SaintLouBrave22]

the can't be a 4pt swing coach..there is no possession change on a technical...ISU could have scored anyway on their possesion without the T and it's a 6 pt game...

Yeah and it wouldve been a 6 pt game with maybe a minute to play...


Instead it was 4 and all it took was 2 missed FT's to make it a one possession game instead of the 4 it could have taken otherwise...


What point are you trying to make exactly?


Either way it was a 4 point swing with only about 9 seconds taken off the clock after the two FT's and the uncontested layup

[mrcoachdude]

the can't be a 4pt swing coach..there is no possession change on a technical...ISU could have scored anyway on their possesion without the T and it's a 6 pt game...

"Anthony Cousin sank the resulting free throws to pull Illinois State within 61-55. Cousin added a layup seven seconds later to complete a four-point possession and get the Redbirds within four, 61-57."

this was in the BU report

After Dunson missed two FT's (OUCH)...Then Wilkings hit a three to make it 61-60...quite the momentum shift...

[lefty]

"Anthony Cousin sank the resulting free throws to pull Illinois State within 61-55. Cousin added a layup seven seconds later to complete a four-point possession and get the Redbirds within four, 61-57."

this was in the BU report

After Dunson missed two FT's (OUCH)...Then Wilkings hit a three to make it 61-60...quite the momentum shift...

good grief coach ISU had the ball anyway...the ft's were an additional 2 points...that's all. ISU could have scored anyway on their possession....have you had your coffee yet?

[lefty]

Yeah and it wouldve been a 6 pt game with maybe a minute to play...


Instead it was 4 and all it took was 2 missed FT's to make it a one possession game instead of the 4 it could have taken otherwise...


What point are you trying to make exactly?


Either way it was a 4 point swing with only about 9 seconds taken off the clock after the two FT's and the uncontested layup

it seems to me it's only a 4 pt swing if you lose a possession....we didn't lose any possession...so I don't see the 4 pt swing.

In the old days if you got a T when you had the ball it was a ft and possession of the ball goes to the other team....then you could have a 5pt "swing" actually losing possession and they score and you lose your opportunity to score when you had it....now it doesn't make any difference who has the ball...possession stays the same..so it actually costs us two ft's and nothing more.

I guess I just see it different than you guys

[houstontxbrave]

Just because ISU had the ball you can not assume they would have scored.

So when Les was given the T, it stopped the possession. They shot 2 fts and made the free throws, then retained possession and scored a two point basket.

Hence the game moved in ISU's favor by 4 points.

Even if Les did not get the T and ISU scored with the ball it would be a 2 point swing.

To me moving the score in a direction is a point swing. Regardless of possession of the ball.

[TheAsianSensation]

The Carmichael T may have been worse than any of the other calls.

This officiating crew lost control of the game. IMO. No way around it.

[SaintLouBrave22]

Just because ISU had the ball you can not assume they would have scored.

So when Les was given the T, it stopped the possession. They shot 2 fts and made the free throws, then retained possession and scored a two point basket.

Hence the game moved in ISU's favor by 4 points.

Even if Les did not get the T and ISU scored with the ball it would be a 2 point swing.

To me moving the score in a direction is a point swing. Regardless of possession of the ball.

That and what people are not realizing is that the T gave Jank time to draw up a double screen and clear out for Cousin basically giving him a free TO during the T...

So yes, I'll stand by it being a 4 pt swing that became 7 as soon as Dodie clanked the two FT's and Wilkins buried the 3 from the corner.

[houstontxbrave]

The Carmichael T may have been worse than any of the other calls.

This officiating crew lost control of the game. IMO. No way around it.

I really thought he hung on the rim and there was no need to hang on the rim. No one was under him.

Personally all 3 T's were rediculous. Janks was on a bigtime bad call. Les well his was at one of the worst possible times and simply was not directed at anyone other then his own player. Unless Les goes running on the floor or gets in an officials face you dont call a T with 1 minute to go when you know full and well his reaction was not directly at you.

The 3 that called that game really had no business calling a D1 game. Both teams got scr*wed.

[BSSFan#1]

I think I see the difference now.

It was a 4-point swing after the technical.

HOWEVER, the technical didn't cause the 4-point swing as only 2 points were scored as a result of the technical (the 2 ft's).

So it was indeed a 4-point swing AFTER the technical but certainly cannot be said that the technical, deserved or not, caused the 4-point swing as only 2 points are directly attributal to the technical.

[BSSFan#1]

Certainly a lot of official bashing after this game.

What do you think of the Warren shove on Wilkins? Did that warrant a technical?

[tornado]

Certainly a lot of official bashing after this game.

What do you think of the Warren shove on Wilkins? Did that warrant a technical?

I didn't think so and the two officials closest to the play weren't going to call a thing until the guy out at half court came running in claiming he was going to call double technicals...it even took the guy a while to explain and convince the other two guys that his calls weren't really wacky...

Wilkins clearly was the instigator and preemptively laid a totally unprovoked, cowardly, blindside shoulder slam into Andrew Warren...
Warren reacted as just about anyone would by lifting his arms to protect himself and pushing Wilkins away to be sure Frenchie wasn't going to slam him again.
I thought AW's actions were 100% defensive.....
I saw nothing in AW's actions to warrant a "T", and maybe only a warning should have been given even to JW -- but maybe a "T" based on what else the refs may have seen or heard.

Keep in mind, that Wilkins had just been fouled on his shot (at 6:26 1st half) -- but fouled by Jake Eastman -- NOT ANDREW WARREN...
I think it was a total brain cramp and bozo move by Wilkins to just presume the foul was committed by Warren and lash out and attack Drew - simply because by the time Wilkins turned around, that's who he saw first.
Wilkins is 13-38 (34%) on 3-pointers in Valley play, but he did hit an important one. He has a 135 career points in the Valley compared to 1419 by Andrew Warren....not to mention Warren's career 3pt shooting is a ton better than JW's......so see you on Thursday in St. Louis Frenchie...

[lefty]

I think I see the difference now.

It was a 4-point swing after the technical.

HOWEVER, the technical didn't cause the 4-point swing as only 2 points were scored as a result of the technical (the 2 ft's).

So it was indeed a 4-point swing AFTER the technical but certainly cannot be said that the technical, deserved or not, caused the 4-point swing as only 2 points are directly attributal to the technical.

shwoooo...glad that's over....that was my point...heck if they miss 2 ft's the T doesn't cost us anything

[Beninator]

The Carmichael T may have been worse than any of the other calls.

This officiating crew lost control of the game. IMO. No way around it.

Certainly a lot of official bashing after this game.

What do you think of the Warren shove on Wilkins? Did that warrant a technical?

IMHO

The Carmichael T was legit as he hung on the rim way too long.

Jank's T was legit even though the situation that led to his T was not. I understand why he got the T as the officials completely blew the call that led to him getting upset. I don't blame Jank for getting a T as if I were coaching, I would have gotten a T as well.

The double technical on AW and Wilkins was a good call as the officials had to establish control of the game. There was a lot of jawing going on before the T and AW was caught reacting to Wilkins' shove.

The JL T was bogus and was a real momentum changer.

I hope that these officials never referee another MVC game again! At least I can dream....