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  • #46
    You won??™t have to go far for a case study into when is the right time to make a change. Mo State, a team 3 years removed from firing a coach with a very similar record to Les, comes in on Sunday. Les has more success in the NCAA tourney, while Barry posted a better league average, but all in all the arguments for and against him and Les are quite similar.

    MSU fans took a lot of heat from Valley fans including Bradley fans for firing Hinson.. A large group of MSU fans and donors wanted Hinson out. A large group of MSU fans and Donors wanted Hinson to stay. He had a sparkling graduation record and the kids stayed out of trouble. The system was in question, recruiting was in question, everything and anything was in question.

    Sound familiar

    The administration at MSU felt it was time to take a chance and see what change would bring. This was a huge risk. There is no doubt in my mind that Hinson would have gotten the ship turned around and been back in yearly contention for 3rd and 4th seed in the tourney, but the administration stuck there neck out and made the change hoping for a consistent 1 or 2 seed. They also committed to a good salary and went with a young un-proven commodity who came from their successful rivals bloodlines.

    Who knows if Cuonzo will take the Bears higher than Hinson. Only time will tell. I will say it was the right time to make the change, and I think the school made a good decision and put Cuonzo in a situation to succeed. If Bradley is ready to do the same, commit the money, take the time to find a young up and comer, and the fan base can be patient, I think it??™s the right time to make a change, but if this is simply a knee jerk reaction to your best two guys out (I think you would have contended for a title with Maniscalco and Brown), and your AD and President don??™t have an idea where they want the program to go, it might be the wrong place wrong time.

    Good luck on Sunday.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Da Coach View Post
      These first 2 posts in this thread says it all. If you want to believe Jim Les has been bad, then cite only those statistics that prove your point. But it's hard to ignore that he has had substantial successes, unless you purposely distort the facts. And we still are ignoring the obvious fact that the success would be much greater if not for unforseen injuries to key players that would affect any coach and are not his fault.
      I will ask again, has there been any other coach in recent MVC history which has gone 9 years without a top 3 MVC finish or MVC Tourney Title? Is this what we now call substantial success? This says it all to me.

      JL is an average coach who has produced average results. If that is good enough for the University, than that's that.

      If he gets one more year, it won't matter. Cause next year there will always be injuries, youth (his prize recruits will only be frosh.=/so), effort with no results, etc.

      We can all check back in 2014-15...if anyone is left who is still intersted....and that's a fact, jack!
      BUilding for the Future

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Da Coach View Post
        Since championships and NCAA appearances are what a lot of fans are complaining about-

        Number of NCAA tournament games ISU has won in the last 5 years- 0 (BU 2)
        Number of times ISU has appeared in the NCAA in the last 5 years- 0 (BU 1)
        Number of times in the last 5 years ISU has won the MVC- 0 (BU 0)
        Number of times in the last 5 years ISU has won the MVC tournament- 0 (BU 0)
        Bradley record against ISU in last 5 seasons- BU 6 ISU 4
        And neither have won a championship and ISU has went through 3 coaches in a short time span...

        If only beating ISU were the only problem....

        Oh and we're now both bad....


        I hope you weren't trying to strengthen your position...

        As Shaq would say, get that weak junk outta here!

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        • #49
          those lists of coaching changes are incomplete as I have shown many times in our own listings here on Bradleyfans
          ..can you possibly be saying that schools are NOT more reluctant to fire coaches, eat their bloated contracts and hire new ones in this economy??

          BTW -- as I recall last year our head coach was FORCED to make new hires within his staff because "someone else" thought the team would do better with different assistants..
          could it possibly be that "someone else" now bears at least part of the responsibility for the current team's performance?

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by Da Coach View Post
            Since championships and NCAA appearances are what a lot of fans are complaining about-

            Number of NCAA tournament games ISU has won in the last 5 years- 0 (BU 2)
            Number of times ISU has appeared in the NCAA in the last 5 years- 0 (BU 1)
            Number of times in the last 5 years ISU has won the MVC- 0 (BU 0)
            Number of times in the last 5 years ISU has won the MVC tournament- 0 (BU 0)
            Bradley record against ISU in last 5 seasons- BU 6 ISU 4

            But Les has been at the helm 9 seasons, so why dont' you post that as a fair and true comparison, not your "selected timeframe.

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by chitown fanatic View Post
              But Les has been at the helm 9 seasons, so why dont' you post that as a fair and true comparison, not your "selected timeframe.
              Next year, the "selected timeframe" of evaluating Les will have change significantly...gotta find a way to throw out this year and last year...I guess the kool-aid krowd will have to pick out his "middle 4 years" as the only timeframe that is useful in any way...

              whatever fits your argument I suppose....

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by tornado View Post
                could it possibly be that "someone else" now bears at least part of the responsibility for the current team's performance?
                Nope! That lame excuse don't play in Peoria tornado. We all know where the buck stops. It stops with the head coach. And I know JL would be the first to say the buck stops with him. Different rats, same pied piper, same results.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by ER3 View Post
                  Next year, the "selected timeframe" of evaluating Les will have change significantly...gotta find a way to throw out this year and last year...I guess the kool-aid krowd will have to pick out his "middle 4 years" as the only timeframe that is useful in any way...

                  whatever fits your argument I suppose....
                  I challenge you to find a coach that had a better final 12 games in the 2006 season! Lifetime contract!
                  Onward and Upward!

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                  • #54
                    I really don't care what any other fan thinks, you are welcome to have any opinion you want. But so am I and so is everyone else.
                    And I will support whatever Bradley does. But why is it that the anti-Jim Les cannot stand when anyone disagrees with them, or when someone posts actual facts that support Jim Les? Others have posted numbers and facts that they use to show Jim Les' deficiencies. They are entitled to do so. But then I post numbers and facts that support Jim Les, and the anti-JL people cry "no fair".

                    You can't have it both ways. Just state your case and leave it at that. We will not tolerate or allow anyone to criticise or attack other posters just because they don't like that they do not agree with them.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by SaintLouBrave22 View Post
                      You may want to look up "substantial" in the dictionary then as to get a more accurate view of what that means as I myself would not consider 59% overall winning percentage or 54% in conference will 1 major postseason berth and countless trips to rinky-dink tournaments to pad win totals substantial success...
                      The guy down the road is 58% in conference, NO major postseason berths, and obviously NO major postseason wins. I wonder how long they'll keep him around with those results.
                      ???People say, ???Forget last year', but I want our guys to remember that one, because that will not happen again. We will be much better.??? Geno Ford, 9/22/12

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by SaintLouBrave22 View Post
                        You may want to look up "substantial" in the dictionary then as to get a more accurate view of what that means as I myself would not consider 59% overall winning percentage or 54% in conference will 1 major postseason berth and countless trips to rinky-dink tournaments to pad win totals substantial success...
                        I never said he has had substantial winning percentage, as you suggest.
                        What I said was - "But it's hard to ignore that he has had substantial successes, unless you purposely distort the facts."

                        And again my words have been distorted to make it look like something unreasonable was said. This is typical in any argument about Jim Les.
                        You would not consider 22 wins two years in a row "substantial"? You wouldn't consider beating Kansas and Pitt and advancing to the Sweet 16 "substantial? It hasn't been done at Bradley since 1954. You wouldn't consider 84 wins over 4 seasons "substantial"? You wouldn't consider more wins over BCS schools than any other 2 MVC schools combined "substantial"? There have been substantial successes. Just because some anti-JL people want to deny or ignore them does not mean they didn't happen.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Da Coach View Post
                          You can't have it both ways. Just state your case and leave it at that. We will not tolerate or allow anyone to criticise or attack other posters just because they don't like that they do not agree with them.
                          This place is out of control today.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Da Coach View Post
                            Since championships and NCAA appearances are what a lot of fans are complaining about-

                            Number of NCAA tournament games ISU has won in the last 5 years- 0 (BU 2)
                            Number of times ISU has appeared in the NCAA in the last 5 years- 0 (BU 1)
                            Number of times in the last 5 years ISU has won the MVC- 0 (BU 0)
                            Number of times in the last 5 years ISU has won the MVC tournament- 0 (BU 0)
                            Bradley record against ISU in last 5 seasons- BU 6 ISU 4
                            This is factual information. However, it doesn't make me feel good that we have been barely better than a lackluster ISU program.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              I think we all want that. The question is how best to achieve it. Should we change leadership, which could possibly lead to a long rebuilding process with no guarantee it will lead to improvement, though it could. Or do we give the current staff more time to overcome the injury setbacks and bring in the pretty good recruits we have locked in for next season?
                              As we can see, there are valid arguments for both options, and nobody here has any real say in the decision.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Please excuse any errors...

                                Conference record
                                Versace 81-49
                                Albeck 41-31
                                Molinari 110-88
                                Les 70-80

                                Home record
                                Versace 90-17
                                Albeck 49-20
                                Molinari 117-36
                                Les 100-38

                                Away record
                                Versace 47-46
                                Albeck 22-42
                                Molinari 43-93
                                Les 32-81

                                Post Season Record
                                Versace 6-3
                                Albeck 0-1
                                Molinari 4-6
                                Les 10-5

                                Record vs. ISU
                                Versace 8-7
                                Albeck 7-4
                                Molinari 10-13
                                Les 10-7

                                MVC Tourney Record
                                Versace 6-6
                                Albeck 3-3
                                Molinari 11-10
                                Les 5-8

                                Average MVC finish
                                Versace ??“ 3
                                Albeck ??“ 4.8
                                Molinari ??“ 4.4
                                Les ??“ 5.2

                                Record with an NBA player
                                Versace (JJ) 67-29
                                Versace (Hawk) 49-16
                                Albeck (Hawk) 43-17
                                Molinari (AP) 82-39
                                Les (POB) 35-26

                                Record Without an NBA Player
                                Versace 31-26
                                Albeck 32-54
                                Molinari 92-113
                                Les 113-105

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