NCAA suspends Ohio State football players

[Da Coach]

But the difference you are forgetting is that Bradley also was nailed with an institutional penalty that included probation for their failure of compliance.
Ohio State did not receive an institutional penalty, and in fact the NCAA apparently delayed the players' penalties because of "inadequate rules training" by Ohio State.
This is inconsistent and a bit hypocritical. In one case they nail BU for not catching it and preventing it, and in the other case OSU, who also failed to prevent the violations, is rewarded because the players were not told it was illegal and against the rules.

[tornado]

Few "impermissible benefits" cases short of the cash to a recruit scandal at Kentucky and the hundreds of thousands given to Reggie Bush..that ended in major violations, except the one at BU

For Bradley to get a major violation for a few hundred $$ inadvertently given to a player, seems unprecedented...
Try to find another example of a case so minor resulting in a major violation and penalties...
all the other examples involve massive and egregious freebies to recruits and players or blatant cheating or use of players who were known to be ineligible.

Example...
Here's what it took for the NCAA to finally agree UConn was committing MAJOR violations....violations that UConn admits to -- so there's no doubt about the truth of these violations, they've been proven!

First, the NCAA knew of plenty of freebies given to players and AAU coaches...then YahooSports wrote a full expose on UConn hiring a guy on their staff )as a "team manager" who was a known agent and who was giving payment and steering players to UConn...
Ahem.......even then the NCAA did not act, since they apparently didn't think this was significant enough...
..then when it was revealed that Jim Calhoun was making more than 1400 illegal recruiting phone calls, and that the agent was also giving "lodging, transportation, meals and representation." (meaning even acting as his professional agent...)
Then...finally the NCAA starts snooping around and UConn "puts itself on 2 years probation" and takes away one scholarship...

Now, guess what -- the NCAA has backed way off and let UConn play this season out and still has not acted!

Whoa...this is so different that the immediate penalties and major sanctions given BU for a few hundred $$ of inadvertent pay!

Then many different schools have been exposed (Kentucky, Arkansas, Memphis, Kansas State) ..for their players getting freebies at local stores, bars, restaurants, and even getting special "VIP" perks and treatment that others would have to pay for.
Never once have I heard any of these cases getting checked by NCAA -- but can you imagine if it had occurred at Bradley -- it would have been a major violation!

[dogsrus]

But the difference you are forgetting is that Bradley also was nailed with an institutional penalty that included probation for their failure of compliance.
Ohio State did not receive an institutional penalty, and in fact the NCAA apparently delayed the players' penalties because of "inadequate rules training" by Ohio State.
This is inconsistent and a bit hypocritical. In one case they nail BU for not catching it and preventing it, and in the other case OSU, who also failed to prevent the violations, is rewarded because the players were not told it was illegal and against the rules.

I think the probation was understandable. It really didn't "hurt" BU and I don't think it was suppose to as this was inadvertent on THEIR part.

The sanctions on the OSU players will hurt OSU...I wonder if the NCAA had that in mind. I mean 5 games is alot. I think its hard to prove OSU knew what was going on but the NCAA always says you SHOULD have known.

Also...BU SHOULD have been monitoring these guys work skeds and $$ they were getting for work done and this is basically what the NCAA said in the ruling/findings as this was something they (BU) set up.

OSU kids were off doing something against the rules on their own. Yeah...OSU SHOULD have known I guess but how do you monitor 60 kids everyday.....

I am NOT saying BU kids or BU did anything worse then OSU. I put BOTH as simple stoopid things college kids do. Bu, IMO, it may not look like it on the surface but this will hurt OSU MUCH worse then BU got hurt.

[Da Coach]

You can spin it any way you want. The lack of any penalty on Ohio State as an institution is proof the NCAA is inconsistent with their own rules, as compared with the penalty to Bradley, despite the fact that circumstances surrounding the incidents appear to be more egregious in the Ohio State case. Placing an institution on probation is a far greater harm to a school (as it is supposed to be) than simply placing a suspension on a few players, especially when the suspension doesn't even begin for another 9 months, and most of the players will have turned pro by then. Ohio State can easily overcome that by simply recruiting other kids to replace them, which they would have had to do anyway.

A penalty like probation, loss of scholarships, or recruiting restrictions would hurt recruiting, which for a school like Bradley is very harmful. Ohio State got off easy, but that does not surprise anyone. The NCAA has proven time and time again that they go easy or look the other way when violations involve the BCS boys, and the come down with a vengeance on the small guys.

[dogsrus]

You can spin it any way you want. The lack of any penalty on Ohio State as an institution is proof the NCAA is inconsistent with their own rules, as compared with the penalty to Bradley, despite the fact that circumstances surrounding the incidents appear to be more egregious in the Ohio State case. Placing an institution on probation is a far greater harm to a school (as it is supposed to be) than simply placing a suspension on a few players, especially when the suspension doesn't even begin for another 9 months, and most of the players will have turned pro by then. Ohio State can easily overcome that by simply recruiting other kids to replace them, which they would have had to do anyway.

A penalty like probation, loss of scholarships, or recruiting restrictions would hurt recruiting, which for a school like Bradley is very harmful. Ohio State got off easy, but that does not surprise anyone. The NCAA has proven time and time again that they go easy or look the other way when violations involve the BCS boys, and the come down with a vengeance on the small guys.

Not spinning anything just giving my opinon. And probabtion does NOT hurt anyone as long as they clean up what the NCAA found wrong. You lump probabtion in with rec. restictions and loss of scholies when they are MILES apart. Proabation won't hurt you at all IF you stay clean. Had BU suffered the other 2 I would have said yes...we were hit harder.

Losing 5-6 starters of next years team for 5 games in a 12 game season can CRUSH a program with National Championship aspirations.

And how can you say, without any of us knowing the REAL facts, that the OSU case was more egregious.

BU players got money for NO work.OUCH...thats not good...PERIOD. BU set these guys up with these jobs and one could EASILY say that they either knew it or it was "arranged" to give them more money for less work. I honestly do not think that was the case but only BU and Star knows the truth.


The OSU guys went out and committed the infractions on their own. I think there are "institutional" infractions and "individual" infractions. In my opinion BOTH the OSU and BU cases were individual infractions. IOW...the players did something on their own. BU could have caught what was going on had they had the correct people in place to monitor and thats what they eventually did and why they got probation. The NCAA gave them time to clean up what was broke.

IF we are going to say OSU KNEW about what was going on we have to be fair and make the same assumption about BU. The NCAA determined OSU failed to educate these kids this was wrong. I don't know all the facts and I will admit I don't understand why OSU didn't get probabtion to fix what was "broke" on thier part but you can have all the protection in place and individual kids will STILL find a way to get in trouble.

[Da Coach]

Not spinning anything just giving my opinon.

That's fine, I am entitled to my opinion, too, and it's pretty clear the NCAA treated these 2 cases quite differently.

Here are the facts-
Bradley did receive an institutional penalty by the NCAA even though the infraction was inadvertant, and nobody at Bradley, including the players, intentionally broke the rules.

Ohio State did not receive an institutional penalty, even though their players did break rules knowingly.

Bradley's players were suspended immediately.

Ohio State's players received a suspension, but it was delayed so it would not affect their team's outcome this season.

And if it your opinion that probation does not hurt a school, then I disagree, and so do most coaches. I have spoken to Division I coaches, and they tell me being on probation is a huge recruiting advantage for a school's opponents, and greatly harms a school's recruiting.

BTW- can anyone recall any previous case involving a case of illegal improper benefits where the NCAA "delayed" their penalty to allow a school to finish out their season and not have the penalty affect them? I can't.

[AZ BU Fan]

Another thread about NCAA looking the other way on major college player and university infractions, and, the disparate treatment of major vs minor universities...YAWN....

Wait, wait, here is the other shoe dropping...how the NCAA has punished BU and its players more than the major schools/conferences and their players...

Every post about NCAA infractions/punishment inevitably comes around to how BU has been unfairly treated by the NCAA in the past...

If you are really frustrated/irate over the inconsistency in NCAA infraction punishment and how BU was screwed, tell it to the NCAA:

The National Collegiate Athletic Association
700 W. Washington Street
P.O. Box 6222
Indianapolis, Indiana 46206-6222

Phone: 317/917-6222
Fax: 317/917-6888


What I find interesting is how ANY of the NCAA MBB players afford the uber expensive tatoos that cover their bodies? Where is the money coming from to pay for these, or how are they affordable, without some sort of NCAA infraction?



Tatoo-gate?

[Da Coach]

I don't think the NCAA cares or has ever cared what kids do with their money. Tattoos aren't the first thing college athletes have ever spent their money on, there have always been expensive items that athletes seem to flaunt. If anyone thinks they are getting their tattoos for free, for a discount, or by trading autographed memorabilia, then the NCAA has a problem with it. But kids have never been required to show receipts for things they purchase.

[tornado]

I, along with a few other people have repeatedly made my feelings known about the NCAA's biased and unfair treatment...and guess what...
finally a few others who are writing a bit more high profile and seen and caught on...
and lo and behold, it's been the bloggers, internet writers, and guys at Yahoo & Rivals that have called NCAA into account and embarrassed them by showing their bias...and suddenly they are finally penalizing (albeit softly) some of the big violators like USC, Indiana, etc...

[dogsrus]

That's fine, I am entitled to my opinion, too, and it's pretty clear the NCAA treated these 2 cases quite differently.

Here are the facts-
Bradley did receive an institutional penalty by the NCAA even though the infraction was inadvertant, and nobody at Bradley, including the players, intentionally broke the rules.

Ohio State did not receive an institutional penalty, even though their players did break rules knowingly.

Bradley's players were suspended immediately.

Ohio State's players received a suspension, but it was delayed so it would not affect their team's outcome this season.

And if it your opinion that probation does not hurt a school, then I disagree, and so do most coaches. I have spoken to Division I coaches, and they tell me being on probation is a huge recruiting advantage for a school's opponents, and greatly harms a school's recruiting.

BTW- can anyone recall any previous case involving a case of illegal improper benefits where the NCAA "delayed" their penalty to allow a school to finish out their season and not have the penalty affect them? I can't.

I have spoke with coaches also and they say probation is nothing IF the school cleans up their act...exactly what probation is meant to do...so thats a wash.

I agree BU players didn't set out to break rules but I'm sorry...anyone that gets a paycheck one week for $200.00 for TEN hours of work then $400.00 for the same ten hours the NEXT week knows they were getting money for nothing and should have spoke up. I agree...BU players didn't set out to get money for nothing and the OSU players most likely understood selling stuff for profit was agaisnt the rules but BU, as an institiution set these guys up in these jobs and therefore assumes the responsibility of whatever happens from that day forward. THATS why BU got the institutional probation. period.

And not suspending OSU players doesn't hurt OSU. They still get the 8 million to share with the Big Ten wether those players play or not in the bowl games. Now, as I have stated...losing Pryor and co. for 5 games NEXT year deystroys OSU in 2011.

I do agree and think OSU should have got some probation to show they would educate players that selling stuff was illegal and will admit that its a copout if a player says he didn't realize it was againt NCAA rules to profit from such acts.

[tornado]

... THATS why BU got the institutional probation. period....

hmmm..then I wonder what explains why the two U of I basketball players who also worked at Star and who also were paid the same way (as proven even by the NCAA report),
never even got investigated nor penalized at all, despite that the owner of Star is and has been an enormous U of I booster and season ticket holder?

Nope -- anyone who actually knows the facts of the case cannot help but come to the conclusion that Bradley was treated far differently than MOST any other school would have been treated.

Note this statement FROM NCAA detailing how BU's relationship with Star had been "proper", and "constructive", and exemplary for "well over a decade",
and that BU was fully cooperative, and that the whole thing was "inadvertent", and an "honest mistake" that was "understandable"...
(those were all NCAA's OWN words!!)

and that all the decisions made that led to the error were "arbitrarily made by a STAR supervisor, and without the knowledge of their ownership or Bradley".

Also -- other statements...
"This is not a case of anyone acting in an unethical manner"
"We are left to wonder how these young men can be given such a severe penalty for an honest mistake made by another well-intended individual. This was an inadvertent benefit with no fraudulent behavior on the part of these student-athletes."

http://www.bradleybraves.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=19329&SPID=1498&DB_OEM_ID=3400&ATCLID=217362

http://www.bradleybraves.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=19329&SPID=1498&DB_OEM_ID=3400&ATCLID=217156

Only much, much later, (In May, 2006) AFTER BRADLEY WENT ON TO WHIP KANSAS & PITT, did the NCAA come back and whallop Bradley with the institutional penalty -- almost as if this was a re-thought when BU did so well in the Sweet Sixteen!!!
PLUS -- this further release again highlights the "INADVERTENT" nature of this incident.
(the Ohio State violations were flagrant, intentional, greedy, organized, plaotted, and premeditated..while the BU incident was "inadvertent" and "honest"!)

http://www.bradleybraves.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&DB_OEM_ID=3400&ATCLID=284567&SPID=1510&SPSID=19447

BTW -- this release by the NCAA clearly states...
"The release also stated that a minimum two-year probation is the “presumptive” penalty for a similar violation"
......oh really?? That is unless it's Ohio State, UConn, or Kansas...right??
So where is the justice??

[dogsrus]

Bradley provided these players with jobs and its thier responsibility to make sure they did the work they got paid for....they failed to monitor that and the NCAA said do that from now on and nothing more will come of this. Probation. The players got a few games suspension as they should have reported it.

I don't see that as being "whalloped"...sounds quite fair to me.

In the end it made BU a better program as they revamped the compliance dept. to make sure these inadvertent benefits didn't happen again.

[tornado]

and Ohio State, UConn, Kansas State, etc...all WERE monitoring??
and Auburn and their star were held NOT to be responsible for negotiating a $180,000 payoff from agents, and the Ohio State guys were given a pass because they were NOT fully informed of rules (yet OSU was not penalized for not doing it)
Remember -- even the NCAA stated plainly that the change in pay at Star was NOT even known to the owner of the company, yet you say BU should have been watching it and known of it!

if the NCAA held every school to the standards of "monitoring" that you impose upon Bradley, then not only would we drop the unemployment rate by a full 5%, we'd finally level the playing field and allow smaller schools to compete with the bigger perennial cheaters


BTW -- Ohio State's own AD blames his own "Compliance Department" and says flatly that they "..falling down on the job"
...so why doesn't NCAA penalize their compliance department??
Meanwhile, our AD's office and compliance department was PRAISED by the NCAA as...
"all individuals associated with STAR Transport and Bradley University have been extremely cooperative and accessible in regards to the investigation."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/2010/12/27/2010-12-27_not_bowled_over_by_buckeye_spin.html?r=sports

the bias is clear and all but a few staunch BCS supporters and NCAA big wigs now admit it...

[houstontxbrave]

"And not suspending OSU players doesn't hurt OSU. They still get the 8 million to share with the Big Ten wether those players play or not in the bowl games. Now, as I have stated...losing Pryor and co. for 5 games NEXT year deystroys OSU in 2011.

I do agree and think OSU should have got some probation to show they would educate players that selling stuff was illegal and will admit that its a copout if a player says he didn't realize it was againt NCAA rules to profit from such acts."

Diveriting the penalty until 2011 in theory will hurt OSU. But in reality assessing the penalty to the bowl game would both hurt OSU right now, hurt ESPN right now and hurt the adverisers right now.

By administering penalties next season it allows some of the players to not be penalized at all... ie Pryor can just simply declare for the NFL and I am guessing also avoid paying the fine.

OSU plays to start next season:

home to Akron
home to Toledo
@ Miami
home to Colorado
home to Michigan State

Anyway, if what the NCAA is saying that the players were not "educated properly" about not selling their personal items for other items is true... two things why are these improperly educated athletes being punished at all? and if it is the institution who was negligent in properly educating the student athlete why isnt it the institution being punished?

The NCAA is punishing the student/athlete for an issue that the institution didnt properly educate the student/athlete.

Anyway Dogs, this whole things is about money/ESPN... no one cares about the first two games in 2011 and I am betting after an appeal the "punished" student/athletes end up on the field in Miami on Sept 17th... I have to guess that one will "magically" appear on ESPN/ABC.

[Fetz86]

I don't know about any magic involved, tOSU gets on tv regularly anyway.