SIU at Indiana State- InSU wins 68-65

[chitown fanatic]

Most define BU as Mediocre NOT based on one game or even a stretch of games...not even ONE season. We use the ENTIRE JL tenure to describe it as mediocre. THAT is an undeniable fact. PERIOD.

SIU, under the same guidelines, over the 8 years has won HOW many MVC titles...how mant NCAA/NIT trips...how many Valley finals ?

While they are mediocre to bad THIS year that is NOT a mediocre program in the same sense that fits BU. PERIOD.

Amen Brother! If I could find the clapping emoticon, I'd put it here.

[afan]

Ceo

Again, it seems like many around here blame JL and staff for EVERYTHING that goes wrong. I've seen it said here in the recent past that JL is the one that recruits the players, therefore maybe we should be recruiting better players. I figured the same would hold true for the other teams, especially all the mediocre teams in the Valley that should apparently be looking for new coaching staffs at the end of this season!

JL is the CEO of the team. In most cases the CEO IS held responsible for the performance of the team no matter what the reason, as he is ultimately responsible for the total results. Of course he also gets the ultimate recognition when things go well. Also he is paid accordingly. When a CEO fails to perform over a period of time he is usually relieved of his duties. The subordinates are not ultimately to blame. The Ceo is as it should be. Eight years is a considerable amount of time for mediocre performance. The attendance has not changed much... but, have you noticed that on the average it is slowly dwindling downward? That's when things become serious. I have also noticed much smaller lines at the concession stands. Haven't you?

[Da Coach]

The attendance has not changed much... but, have you noticed that on the average it is slowly dwindling downward?

Attendance under Jim Les has been consistently good. Of course, winning makes a difference, so in a down year there could end up being a slight reduction in overall attendance. But I suspect the powers at Bradley are much more concerned with the other factors which much more accurately indicate support- season ticket sales, advertising revenues, TV ratings, donations, etc., - which are all much higher than they were under the previous coach.

For the record- attendance at college basketball events is dropping all over the country. Sure there are a few examples where it's not, but overall people have many more entertainment options, hundreds of more TV channels, dozens of more televised games to stay home and watch, and less money to spend. The local levels of unemployment and the terrible economy alone should have caused much more significant reductions in Bradley attendance than it has, yet we've seen very little of this.

[afan]

interest dwindling

Attendance under Jim Les has been consistently good. Of course, winning makes a difference, so in a down year there could end up being a slight reduction in overall attendance. But I suspect the powers at Bradley are much more concerned with the other factors which much more accurately indicate support- season ticket sales, advertising revenues, TV ratings, donations, etc., - which are all much higher than they were under the previous coach.

For the record- attendance at college basketball events is dropping all over the country. Sure there are a few examples where it's not, but overall people have many more entertainment options, hundreds of more TV channels, dozens of more televised games to stay home and watch, and less money to spend. The local levels of unemployment and the terrible economy alone should have caused much more significant reductions in Bradley attendance than it has, yet we've seen very little of this.

Coach I agree with everything that you have said, Unfortunately, I believe that it is more than that. When we had the white out the other night I was amazed at the partial participation from the fans. About half had white the other half red and miscellaneous. Remember the Michigan State game ?...Complete whiteout! I just feel that the fan support is going down due to the home losses and the inconsistent play. My point is that the CEO has to get results to keep his job in most cases. Having said that, I am a big JL fan and a huge Bradley fan. I think that most of our posters are right when they vent their disappointment over the performance, in general, of the last 8 years. I think that it is starting to show up at the box office...

[shaunguth]

Or, perhaps should have insisted that they spend more time practicing their freethrows, or, perhaps had a coach work with them on improved technique. Even when it comes to shooting freethrows there is something the coach can contribute to the improvement of the team.

So after a good free-throw shooting night, JL gets all the credit and then he forgets to spend the next practice coaching free throws and certain players forgot how?

[shaunguth]

Most define BU as Mediocre NOT based on one game or even a stretch of games...not even ONE season. We use the ENTIRE JL tenure to describe it as mediocre. THAT is an undeniable fact. PERIOD.

SIU, under the same guidelines, over the 8 years has won HOW many MVC titles...how mant NCAA/NIT trips...how many Valley finals ?

While they are mediocre to bad THIS year that is NOT a mediocre program in the same sense that fits BU. PERIOD.

I understand what you're saying, but I have a hard time understanding how JL years 1-3 are so prominent since that's when the majority of his conference losses occurred, but the Sweet 16 is simply dismissed as a fluke and apparently doesn't mean too much to some people around here anymore.

[dogsrus]

Coach I agree with everything that you have said, Unfortunately, I believe that it is more than that. When we had the white out the other night I was amazed at the partial participation from the fans. About half had white the other half red and miscellaneous. Remember the Michigan State game ?...Complete whiteout! I just feel that the fan support is going down due to the home losses and the inconsistent play. My point is that the CEO has to get results to keep his job in most cases. Having said that, I am a big JL fan and a huge Bradley fan. I think that most of our posters are right when they vent their disappointment over the performance, in general, of the last 8 years. I think that it is starting to show up at the box office...

100 % undeniably dead on fact. PERIOD.


Anyone that can't see or feel that things are falling apart, slowly, is NOT being honest or has their head buried in the sand. That crowd for CU SHOULD have been close to a sellout if NOT a total sellout.

What we had though was 8000 MAYBE 8200 that to their credit really tried to "get into it" but every time they did we'd leave a guy wide open to drain a 3. And once again a crowd that was the best of the year (sigh) were sent home dissapointed once again.

We are losing more and more fans and interest EVERY game. The predicatable 3 game winning streak helped but the next two losses, CU in the book and ISU soon to follow, are just going to continue to crush this program.

I don't say this to "flame" or to rip anyone with the program. I understand they are trying but when will enough be enough? I say all this becuase I REALLY care about BU and where we are headed or where we are, as always, treading water just to stay mediocre.

[dogsrus]

I understand what you're saying, but I have a hard time understanding how JL years 1-3 are so prominent since that's when the majority of his conference losses occurred, but the Sweet 16 is simply dismissed as a fluke and apparently doesn't mean too much to some people around here anymore.

I understand. Personally I have never dissmissed the sweet 16 as a fluke. I don't like dismissing the first 3 years becuase JL was NOT handed a program in shambles but even if you did give him a flyer on those I still feel the program hasn't achieved all it can.....


I will concede the first three years IF you put a greater importance on these last three.

If you are happy with 2 EIEIO tourneys, a 4th, 5th and what a 5th/6th/7th THIS year...????well...more power to you. Had we gone EIEIO, NIT and this year be solidly in the mix for an NCAA bid...yeah, you'd have something.

But what we DO have is a program that is losing fans, interest and once again headed for 2:30 Friday (or g@d forbid worse) THIS year.

Is there time to rally...yes. Is it likely, NOT looking good.

[tornado]

I disagree.........I don't argue that nobody likes losses, and winning would bring a few more fans...but win or lose, Bradley has great fans and great fan support!

People buy their season tickets months ahead of time, and BU's season ticket sales have been as high as at any time in 20 years...
(there has been only one year ever prior to the past few where every seat in the lower bowl is sold on a season basis)
and they make their plans to be at the game weeks and weeks in advance...

BUT - the decision to call Wednesday's game a White-out was made only a little more than 24 hours ahead of game! it was a nice try to help drum up fan enthusiasm
for a mid-week game between two teams that have about .500 records, and there was bad weather...

Go back and look at our game thread about the Creighton game...
the thread was started Sat. 1/23, and it was already THIRTY posts long when BU issued it's Pre-game Notes that called for a white out...

even then, the mention of the white out was somewhat obscurely placed in a long pregame press release...and surely a whole lot of people don't get their news from the BU Braves web site..

Bradley Basketball Pregame Notes
Game 20 - Creighton Bluejays (10-10, 5-4 MVC) at Bradley Braves (10-9, 5-4 MVC)
Wednesday, Jan. 27 - 7:05 p.m. CST - Peoria, Ill. - Carver Arena (11,164)
Series History - Tied 39-39
Television: Comcast Spotlight (Central Illinois 74 and Chicago 102) - Frank Bussone (play-by-play), Dick Versace (analyst) and Danny Adams (sideline)
Radio: 1470 AM WMBD -- Dave Snell (play-by-play), Chuck Buescher (analyst), Joe Stowell (analyst) and Dan DiOrio (pregame host)
Online: BradleyBraves.com - subscription video streams, free audio streams and live stats
On A Roll
Two teams locked in the third-place logjam in the Missouri Valley Conference standings will battle Wednesday night at Carver Arena when Creighton visits Bradley...Bradley has won three straight games for the second time this season and the Braves will shoot for their longest winning streak since a five-gamer from Dec. 23, 2008-Jan. 6, 2009...Wednesday's game features The Valley's two coaching deans: Bradley's Jim Les (250 games in eight years) and Creighton's Dana Altman (489 in 16 seasons) have combined to coach 739 games at their respective schools, while the league's other eight head coaches have combined for 746 games with their respective teams.
Just The Bears
Heading into Wednesday's game versus Creighton, Missouri State (26-17) is the only current Missouri Valley Conference member with a winning record against Bradley...As the series between the Braves and Bluejays is tied at 39-39, Creighton could become the second Valley team with the series edge against Bradley with a win Wednesday night...The Bluejays have put themselves in position to take over the series edge by winning 16 of the last 19 meetings, dating to Feb. 14, 2001.
White Out Conditions
Wednesday's game has been deemed a Bradley Basketball White Out: fans are encouraged to wear white and Bradley will enhance the effect by distributing white Bradley Basketball t-shirts to everyone in attendance...In addition, the Extreme Team will entertain fans at halftime with their high-flying slam dunk exhibition.
With A Win...
Bradley will extend its winning streak to four games, its longest since a five-game streak from Dec. 23, 2008-Jan. 6, 2009...The Braves will snap a four-game losing streak against Creighton and reclaim the all-time series lead versus the Bluejays...Bradley will earn its fourth consecutive home victory...The Braves could climb into at least a three-way tie for second in The Valley standings if Illinois State also wins at Wichita State.
With A Loss...
Bradley will suffer a fifth consecutive loss to Creighton and will fall behind the Bluejays in the all-time series...The Braves will suffer their fourth home loss of the season and second in Valley play...The Braves could drop as low as a tie for sixth place in the league standings.
Carver Arena
Wednesday's game will be Bradley's 403rd at Carver Arena...Bradley is 304-98 (.756) at Carver Arena since moving its home games to the Peoria Civic Center to start the 1982-83 season...Included in that record, Bradley is 170-65 (.723) in Missouri Valley Conference games at Carver Arena...Bradley is 72-20 (.783) at Carver Arena since the start of the 2004-05 season.
Climbing The Coaching List
Eighth-year Bradley head coach Jim Les will coach his 251st game Wednesday night against Creighton...Currently tied with the legendary Chuck Orsborn for fourth place ...etc...


Basically, unless you read about it on BradleyFans, you wouldn't have known it was a white out...
Here's the pregame story from the local newspaper and they don't make a mention of it either......

http://www.bradleyhoops.com/homepage/x349736806/BU-aware-Jays-may-have-a-rallying-cry

nothing about a white out was said as people entered the arena, and it wasn't on their programs or scorecards...
The entryways from the lobby only had a couple people at the sides handing out shirts, so lots and lots of fans entered and didn't even know they were supposed to take a shirt or wear one......
it certainly had nothing to do with lack of fan interest, so nice try trying to make a bogus point!

I kinda think it's unfair to label the fans as disinterested and use this example, when we still drew almost 10,000 loud fans for a mid-week game on a bad weather night...
There are fewer that 10 midmajor programs that draw as well as BU, so I really don't get this point of criticizing the fans and calling them disinterested...

[dogsrus]

BU has great fans. 6500 season ticket sales strong and those fans will usually come heck or highwater.

I don't worry about those fans to much allthough MANY are grumbling.

What we are losing is the NEXT tier of fans that every program has. The casual fan that can be made into a lifelong next level fan if things are going well. Those fans will come but don't YET have the unwavering committment the 6500 season tic holders have.

Do they want to come and see BU blow another lead or do something else......many of those fans have been staying home.

10,000 for CU.....now THATS funny. Bahgdad Bob told us Iraq was winning the war and they had turned back the US infidels also....

I talk to an usher EVERY game and he's been there for 20 years. He makes an art of figuring out attendance. Has EACH section broke down to what it holds. He had 8500 for the CU game. To get to 10k MOST of the upper end zone needs filled. Those were empty as were the top 15 rows of the upper sides. Put in numerous scattered empty upper and lower bowl seats and bam....8500.

And what " announcement" do you need for a White out? You show up and they are handing out T shirts....do the fans need instructions on how to put it on? If fans care they will do that. Many of these don't care so why make the "effort" to slip a simple shirt on. They aren't feeling the excitement.

You can just feel the air going out of the balloon every game. You look around and its fans rolling their eyes...you sneak into the bathroom at a timeout and you get a GREAT sense of how fans feel by the comments made as people try to rush back to their seats.....things like "here we go again"....or " what is wrong with this team"....I hear it almost every game. They were ready to explode for CU but ONCE again BU never gave em the chance. Thats the stuff that is killing us. Fans won't GIVE if they don't feel they are getting much in return.

We haven't lost the masses like we did Mo's last year or anywhere near Albecks final stages but the feeling is close and people aren't going to settle for mediocrity to much longer. Thats an undeniable FACT.

Our St Louis contingent used to be great also and for the last few years we have been falling off steadily and I predict THIS year will be the worst in MANY MANY years.

[Da Coach]

And what " announcement" do you need for a White out? You show up and they are handing out T shirts....do the fans need instructions on how to put it on?

For the record- most fans at the game did not know it was a "white out". Even President Glasser didn't know about it.
Yes, white t-shirts were given away at the door, but many fans have a drawer full of similar shirts from past games, and didn't bother to pick up another one, because they did not know they were supposed to put it on for a white-out. Even the fans that did take t-shirts were not aware the idea was for them to put them on and wear them. The fans around me simply thought it was another giveaway promotion, and stuffed them into their coats and purses to take home and give to someone.
Even if someone would have made an announcement over the PA system, or posted an announcement on the scoreboard telling fans to put on the t-shirts and wear them for the white-out it would have made a difference. But most fans simply knew nothing about it.

[dogsrus]

For the record- most fans at the game did not know it was a "white out". Even President Glasser didn't know about it.
Yes, white t-shirts were given away at the door, but many fans have a drawer full of similar shirts from past games, and didn't bother to pick up another one, because they did not know they were supposed to put it on for a white-out. Even the fans that did take t-shirts were not aware the idea was for them to put them on and wear them. The fans around me simply thought it was another giveaway promotion, and stuffed them into their coats and purses to take home and give to someone.
Even if someone would have made an announcement over the PA system, or posted an announcement on the scoreboard telling fans to put on the t-shirts and wear them for the white-out it would have made a difference. But most fans simply knew nothing about it.

Thats too bad BU didn't promote more but thats on them....I STILL say its a no-brainer though as we have gone through MULTIPLE white-outs. People know what to do. I think I saw a couple cavemen put the T's on...simple.

I still contend fans just don't care that much.

[tornado]

some don't and I think they would all rather be posting here recently...

I say head down to Redbird Arena, scalp a couple tix, and get in there and be a fan!