Best players in the state, regardless of class

[Da Coach]

This article does an unscientific survey of college coaches (mostly assistants) and comes up with a list of the best players in Illinois, regardless of class, excluding Jeremy Richmond.-

http://blogs.suntimes.com/hoopsreport/2009/06/and_the_survey_says.html

2 things I notice- the coaches surveyed probably were much more familiar with the Chicago area kids, than any kids downstate, so that slants the survey. And, like fans, it seems the survey heavily favors the very youngest kids, showing that potential is weighted more than accomplishments. 3 of the top 4 on the list will be freshmen next season, and therefore haven't yet played a minute of high school basketball yet.

[tornado]

interesting, Chasson Randle gets a 1st place and a 2nd place vote, but isn't even listed on the entire ballots of the other 16 coaches.
It is obvious they don't care much about downstate players unless they have verballed to Illinois.
But still, leaving off solid D-I players like Lenzelle Smith, Donivine Stewart, and Bobo Drummond means they simply
made the mistake of verballing somewhere besides Illinois or living downstate.

[midstateknowitall]

I think the list is pretty realistic as far as Best College Prospect List.... All the players on the list are either tall or extremely athletic.

Lenzell Smith Jr: Tough player, hard high school match up, good size decent athleticism, and understands the game. Will be a good coach player. Lacks the explosiveness and quickness to be in the Top 10 of this list.

Antonio Drummond: Great Freshman Year at Central. He is poised beyond his years. Height is what will hold him back from this list. Another player that just knows how to play the game. He will be good, but based on potential his ceiling isnt as high as these 10 other guys.

Donivine Stewart: Potential is tapped out. He isn't growing anymore, he might because a lil quicker and a little bit more explosive. However, neither of those attributes for him are Top 10 worthy. He is a gifted player offensively (however he has the reign to shoot whenever he wants). He is very poised and has a very good bball IQ.. But brings you nothing as far as athleticism, height, explosiveness, length.

I do think central illinois players get shafted on a lot of these rankings by people upstate. However, I feel they got this Top 10 list pretty good.

[tornado]

Stewart will play in the Big Ten or Big East and will probably log decent minutes even as a freshman.
which brings up the question of how you define "the best prospects"...
since every assessment I have ever seen of Egwu, says the guy is very, very raw, and might be years away from full potential.
He also might just turn into another Aziz N-Diaye, Thijin Moses, or Brett Thompson and spend years before ever even getting any D-I minutes...

[combes]

tornado, the Illinois comment is not accurate. If that was the case, then wouldn't Crandall Head be ranked much higher? And Illinois has offered Drummond, who is not listed at all. On the other hand, since Illinois recruits the best players in the state, it is also logical that most of the top guys on the list would have Illinois ties.

[tornado]

fair.........then honestly answer this....
the guy is a writer for the Sun Times, he is in Chicago and asks 18 college coaches, mostly assistants to participate...
what's your rough guess as to how many of the coaches asked (no names or identities were revealed) were from south of LaGrange or were NOT affiliated with University of Illinois.

here's my rough guess....0%

so he's entitled to do any poll or story he wants, but let's be honest about it.....it is strongly likely this was all heavily tilted by the guy asking only coaches who are Chicago-centric.

[BU RICK]

Hersey Hawkins, Joe Allen, Mitchell Anderson, Willie Scott, Donald Reese, etc......... Our best teams had Chicago players, when do we start recruiting Chicago again rather than building up frequent flier miles and taking a vacation to Phoenix to study a three guard offense that really didn't work out. Chicago should always be on the top of the list, ask Dick Versace or Joe Stowell JMO

[midstateknowitall]

BU RICK

I agree with you 100% I have been living in Peoria almost the last 5 years. I have failed to see BU recruit Chicago, let alone, the state of Illinois that hard. Your school is located in arguably the best basketball state in the country, yet you don't recruit it. Since I have been in Peoria, Bradley has had:

DAN RUFFIN: THANKS OLDER BEUSCHER
JEREMY CROUCH: PEKIN PRODUCT (COME ACROSS THE BRIDGE)
SAM MANISCALCO: DAD PLAYED HERE
DYRECIUS SIMMS-EDWARDS: HOMETOWN KID
JORDAN PROSSER: 25 MINS AWAY

Honestly: to me it seems like if they aren't local or have a tie to Bradley they don't have a chance. Your not going to find better guards in the country then the ones that this state produces yet Bradley goes all over the country and JUCO JUCO JUCO for all these guys. Hard to stomach for me, if your school in this state.

Peoria Area has good players, they always do. But besides DJ RICHARDSON recently it really hasn't had that Star Power. Or absolute must have type of prospect. Size and Athleticism is so Important now. Unfortuntely the closest thing to Peoria has to a "chicago athlete" is Andrew Jordan 6'5 Forward. Andrew is long and tall and agile. However, up there there is a million players like him and even more explosive than he is. Andrew is still a talent however.

[Da Coach]

Hersey Hawkins, Joe Allen, Mitchell Anderson, Willie Scott, Donald Reese, etc......... Our best teams had Chicago players, when do we start recruiting Chicago again rather than building up frequent flier miles and taking a vacation to Phoenix to study a three guard offense that really didn't work out. Chicago should always be on the top of the list, ask Dick Versace or Joe Stowell JMO

Sorry, but it is a mistake to say that Bradley has "failed to...recruit Chicago". Nothing is further from the truth.
Bradley has spent enormous resources, and untold amounts of time recruiting some very good Chicago athletes. Darius Smith is one of the latest examples, but there have been many more. If anyone wants more examples, check our recruiting board, or PM me and I will give many more examples.

However, recruiting the better Chicago players is a totally different game than it was when Joe Stowell and Dick Versace coached. Now, a college coach has to deal with several layers of "handlers", AAU coaches, and family "friends, as well as with the Chicago Public League high school coaches. For many reasons which we have gone into here before, these people just aren't willing to let Bradley into the game in Chicago, unless certain requirements are met. And Bradley recruits ethically and honestly, which precludes them from many of those top high school prospects. Again, I won't go into details here, but if anyone here doesn't understand what I am talking about, PM me and I'll give more details.

By the way, it is not just Bradley that doesn't get many Chicago kids. Most of the solid midmajor programs in the midwest don't even bother to make an effort to recruit Chicago Public League players, and the few that do have learned how to play their game. Even the Chicago schools get surprisingly few CPL kids. Check the rosters of Loyola, UIC, Northwestern, and Chicago State.

By the way- does anyone think Bradley should be able to out-recruit schools like UConn, which is where Darius Smith commmitted? Should Bradley be able to outrecruit Illinois, Big Ten, and Big 12 schools for the top Chicago prospects? That's not realistic.
For those critical of Bradley's recruiting in Chicago- Can anyone name any Public League players that Bradley could have gotten, who did go to another midmajor and that turned into outstanding players?
There are not many.
I think the players Bradley gets are as talented as any CPL kids that Bradley could have gotten anyway. And they come with a whole lot less baggage.
Outside of Osiris Eldridge, who Bradley almost got, the Chicago kids that ISU and other midmajors get are 2nd tier kids, and not the kind of "star" players that critics think Bradley should be getting out of Chicago every year. I think BU does a great job recruiting, and does spend an appropriate amount of time, effort, and money recruiting Chicago, but the emphasis on getting Chicago kids is way overblown.
And realize this factor, too-- Maybe if Bradley concentrates more on Chicago kids, we wouldn't have gotten Andrew Warren, Eddren McCain, or John Wilkins to come to Bradley.

One final example- Bradley recruited a couple of talented kids, Kevin Johnson and Tim Flowers from Simeon a couple years ago. They spurned Bradley, ended up at Wi$consin-Milwaukee, then flunked out. They both went to junior college, but Kevin Johnson dropped out of juco, robbed a store, and is now in jail, and Flowers has underachieved so poorly, he is now at Chicago State (I think), and will probably never amount to much and I predict he'll never finish college. There are also now allegations about phony SAT scores, and altered grades at Simeon to allow them to get eligible in the first place. If Bradley had landed either of these guys, the same critics who think we don't get enough Chicago kids would be attacking Jim Les for bringing in kids like this with questionable character and academics.

I, for one, am glad our coaches are careful and discerning when it comes to the Chicago recruiting.

[tornado]

..but there have been many more. ....

Of course there have...he is just an off the top of the head listing of kids I know BU has contacted and been associated with...

among the recent guys...of course there have...Iman Shumpert, Ben Brust, Sam Maniscalco, Darius Smith, Chris Colvin, Drew Crawford, Diamond Taylor, Michael Haynes, DJ Cooper, Joe Bertrand, Cully Payne, Jordan Threloff, Alex Rossi, Anthony Johnson.
but also over past years.....Mike Rembert, Jamarcus Ellis, Jeremy Fears, Tyrone Kent, Parrish West, Osiris Eldridge, TJ Marion, Pat Beverly, Devan Bawinkel, Evan Turner, Demond Watt, Josh Crittle, Nick Fruendt.

Of all the effort spent and recruiting miles....one can easily see we haven't gotten much out of Chicago area...
so if anything can be said, we spend MORE time and effort there than is really worthwhile!
Good thing Coach Les also saturates other areas with his recruiting efforts!

Basically, since we don't kiss a** to the Chicago coaches and AAU bosses, we don't get the favors......
I guess we could hire a Chicago AAU boss like some other instate MVC schools did, or hire a former Chicago high school coach like they did also......but I, for one, am happy we have not...
No sooner did SIU sell out by hiring Irvin and bringing in a bunch of Chicago kids, and they have had roster turmoil ever since and lost 18 games!
Facts are facts....we just don't get a lot from Chicago but it is not because our coach fails in any way...

..If Bradley had landed either of these guys, the same critics who think we don't get enough Chicago kids would be attacking Jim Les for bringing in kids like this with questionable character and academics. ...

..bullseye......

[midstateknowitall]

By Chicago, I don't mean just the City but the, area as a whole.

2009 Class:

Recruits that are outside the Peoria Area and have no ties to Bradley:


James Kinney: Ohio University (champaign centennial)

Terrance Johnson Jr: IL State (north lawndale)

David Brown: Western Mich (rockton hononegah)

David Smith: Drake (lake forest academy)

Zeke Upshaw: IL State (chicago university high)

Tony Nixon: Northern IL (seton academy)

DJ Cooper: Ohio University (seton academy)

[Da Coach]

I know Jim Les liked David Brown, and there is a little bit of mystery why he chose Western Michigan over higher offers and interest, but the others on your list I believe Bradley felt they already had better players and recruits, and were pursuing recruits they rated much higher.

Also, not a single one of those kids has scored a single point or done anything at the collegiate level yet. I'd like to hear some examples of kids that actually accomplished something significant at another school that Bradley could have had.

[midstateknowitall]

Iman Shumpert: GEORGIA TECH
Ben Brust: BCS CONFRENCE BOUND
Sam Maniscalco: Love the kid's game (Dad went to bradley)
Darius Smith: UCONN
Chris Colvin: IOWA STATE
Drew Crawford: NORTHWESTERN
Diamond Taylor: WISCONSIN
Michael Haynes: JUCO
Joe Bertrand: ILLINOIS
Cully Payne: IOWA
Jordan Threloff: BCS CONFRENCE BOUND
Alex Rossi: BCS CONFRENCE BOUND
Anthony Johnson: PURDUE

How bout we go after kids we can actually have a chance at getting. Look at all those schools and ask why would you choose Bradly over that. Not saying you shouldn't try to get some of these guys but how bout being realistic. Bradley is not going to get someone one of these schools offered very often, if ever...

Also, its one thing to recruit a kid. Its another to land a recruit. Maybe, its the coaches that can't produce recruits. Same thing Illinois and Bruce Weber got bashed for for not getting chicago or being involved with chicago kids. Then Jerrance Howard comes along and BAM .. a coach that has a connection to the kids, the school he is at, and a passion/purpose for recruiting..

[tornado]

You can only get the kids who are willing to come play at BU and stay at BU...
nobody else at BU has done any better than Jim Les in the past 25+ years.....
and things have definitely changed a ton since then with the bosses, handlers, and insider "benefits" that help to determine where the kids end up...


BTW Iowa, Indiana, and Wisconsin also used to make a killing regularly getting some of the top Illinois and Chicago area kids...
BUT...not one single Chicago area kid is on the Iowa roster (Cully Payne is from Burlington - closer to Freeport and Sterling than to downtown Chicago) and they've had fewer than BU has had in the past several years.
And only Diamond Taylor from Bolingbrook on Wisconsin's roster reflects a Chicago area or Illinois presence.
And you have to go back two years to Eric Gordon who gave IU only a single season, to see a Chicago benefit at Indiana, and not a single present player on IU's roster hails from even 100 miles from Chicago!!!


Likewise...Purdue, Michigan State, and Michigan all have EXACTLY ZERO players from Chicago,
and two of the three don't even have an Illinois player!!!!!!!!
Maybe let's start chiding Matt Painter, Tom Crean, and Bo Ryan for no recruiting Chicago!!

I think it reflects more the Chicago kids going where the money is......
These guys sure do get a lot of Chicago kids, and just coincidentally also have a ton of Nike shoe money!

[midstateknowitall]

Kevin Dillard: SIU
Carl Richards: Indiana State
Jeremy Robinson: IL State
Ryan Hare: SIU
Jon Moran: Northern Iowa
Carlton Fay: SIU
Justin Bocot: SIU
Lucas O'Rear: Northern Iowa
Kavon Lacey: Evansville
Isiah Martin: Indiana State
Nick Evans: SIU


These are guys I know went Valley.