Flagrant foul!!

[dogsrus]

Folks this stuff has been going on for YEARS in the Association. The league has no interest in seeing Chicago in the second round, they need(want) Boston and Cleveland in the Eastern finals. Its all about ratings and $$$.

The same stuff was done to other teams when the Bulls were in the Hayday in the 90's... go ask a Pacers fan if they thought the officials were fair to them. Jordan last shot made in a Bulls uniform was a complete shove off on the Utah player.

But realistically it does not matter, its already Lakers v Cavs in the finals... thats a book it.

Oh and yes Rondo's foul was flagerant, he made no attempt to play anything other then Brad Miller, he made no effort to play the ball. But I am wondering why Brad Miller is doing a finger roll from 4 feet away from the rim...

Oh and the elbow punch by Howard last night in Orlando was slightly less worse then the punch Rudy T took from Kermit Washington.

I bet Rondo gets no suspension and Howard gets one game for a flat out punch. The association is and has always been a complete joke when it comes to officiating games.

What got me is why they couldn't upgrade it to a flagrant foul after the review. I don't agree that its a league conspiracy like you but its that the refs simply don't want to make a call that will possibly cause a team...the home team no less..to lose. No guts.

To me its about just simply doing the right thing and let the chips fall where they may as far as backlash from fans and the league office ......

Watching that ref tell the Bulls coach he swiped at the ball and basically missed hitting Miller in the mouth accidentally was an insult to the Bulls and any fan watching.

[dogsrus]

I thought he hit the rim to, but I don't think the ball hit the backboard or the rim because of the flagrant foul Miller got, so no goaltending call. But give credit, it was a well draw up play that most likely would of ended up a 2 pointer had the foul not accrued (One for the Bradley play books).
Miller sill should of made the free throws as he is a good FT shooter. The second FT shot miss might of worked had it hit the rim
Where's MJ, SP and SK when you need them

Tough to hit a free throw following a right cross though...sure he SHOULD have made it...I'm sure he wanted to and tried but look at Gordon and Hinrich the other day...both guys clanged freebies late...it happens.

I agree it was a well drawn up play. I said right before they through the ball in...watch for Gordon/Kirk to be a decoys and some other guy take the shot. I actually thought it would be a Miller 10 footer. But to get that open drive to the hoop was genious.

[houstontxbrave]

Tough to hit a free throw following a right cross though...sure he SHOULD have made it...I'm sure he wanted to and tried but look at Gordon and Hinrich the other day...both guys clanged freebies late...it happens.

I agree it was a well drawn up play. I said right before they through the ball in...watch for Gordon/Kirk to be a decoys and some other guy take the shot. I actually thought it would be a Miller 10 footer. But to get that open drive to the hoop was genious.

The free throws by Miller really should not have been shot by Miller. It was pretty obvious that he was out of it so to speak. But the issue with Miller not shooting is Rivers gets the choice on who shoots the free throws and the Bulls lose Miller for the rest of the game.

It was a very well designed inbounds play but I question was it ran for the right guy on the floor at that time. Meaning if you are going to run a play with that amount of time left run it for someone who has a little athletic ability.. IE TT or Tim Thomas. Miller has very little ability to get to the rim and finish and again he flipped up a finger roll instead of going hard to the rim and dunking it.

And yes I believe the NBA is nothing but the WWF in a basketball uniform. And it has been that way for a very long time.

[ER3]

The reality of the situation is that the Bulls wouldn't have needed help from the refs on the Brad Miller call at the end...if they just would sent a second man at Paul Pierce every time he got the ball late in the 4th quarter and in overtime. Once Ray Allen fouled out, it was absolutely mind-boggling to me that Del Negro repeatedly let Paul Pierce operate 1-on-1 against Salmons or Rose. Horrible approach in my opinion...
You've got to make Pierce give that ball up...the Celts had total zeroes offensively like Marbury and Tony Allen on the floor during that OT...whoever is guarding one of those mopes simply had to run at Pierce and make him get rid of the ball...If Rondo, Marbury, T. Allen, or Davis hit a jumpshot to beat you, so be it...but why did Del Negro allow Pierce to get an easy shot off...time after time after time at the end of that game?
Made no sense to me as I was watching the game...makes less sense to me now...

[Out of Balance]

The free throws by Miller really should not have been shot by Miller. It was pretty obvious that he was out of it so to speak. But the issue with Miller not shooting is Rivers gets the choice on who shoots the free throws and the Bulls lose Miller for the rest of the game.

It was a very well designed inbounds play but I question was it ran for the right guy on the floor at that time. Meaning if you are going to run a play with that amount of time left run it for someone who has a little athletic ability.. IE TT or Tim Thomas. Miller has very little ability to get to the rim and finish and again he flipped up a finger roll instead of going hard to the rim and dunking it.
And yes I believe the NBA is nothing but the WWF in a basketball uniform. And it has been that way for a very long time.

If I remember right, there was only 3.2 on the clock and some of that time was run down out front on the inbound play and the pass to Miller. I think the play was for Miller to take it all the way to the hoop but he threw the finger roll either because he thought time was running out or maybe he seen Rondo and anticipated a foul. There was no time left on the clock after the foul. With the game on the line, Miller dazed/hurt, the right thing maybe would of been to have someone else shoot even if it meant the lost of Miller if the game continued. He's a Boilermaker, tough and should of made them Maybe he has a career after BB is in the WWF, at lease he has the size and looks for it

[houstontxbrave]

The reality of the situation is that the Bulls wouldn't have needed help from the refs on the Brad Miller call at the end...if they just would sent a second man at Paul Pierce every time he got the ball late in the 4th quarter and in overtime. Once Ray Allen fouled out, it was absolutely mind-boggling to me that Del Negro repeatedly let Paul Pierce operate 1-on-1 against Salmons or Rose. Horrible approach in my opinion...
You've got to make Pierce give that ball up...the Celts had total zeroes offensively like Marbury and Tony Allen on the floor during that OT...whoever is guarding one of those mopes simply had to run at Pierce and make him get rid of the ball...If Rondo, Marbury, T. Allen, or Davis hit a jumpshot to beat you, so be it...but why did Del Negro allow Pierce to get an easy shot off...time after time after time at the end of that game?
Made no sense to me as I was watching the game...makes less sense to me now...

Completely agree. No way you let Pierce dictate the game with the ball in his hands. You have to take it out of his hands and double teaming him was what was needed.

[Out of Balance]

The reality of the situation is that the Bulls wouldn't have needed help from the refs on the Brad Miller call at the end...if they just would sent a second man at Paul Pierce every time he got the ball late in the 4th quarter and in overtime. Once Ray Allen fouled out, it was absolutely mind-boggling to me that Del Negro repeatedly let Paul Pierce operate 1-on-1 against Salmons or Rose. Horrible approach in my opinion...
You've got to make Pierce give that ball up...the Celts had total zeroes offensively like Marbury and Tony Allen on the floor during that OT...whoever is guarding one of those mopes simply had to run at Pierce and make him get rid of the ball...If Rondo, Marbury, T. Allen, or Davis hit a jumpshot to beat you, so be it...but why did Del Negro allow Pierce to get an easy shot off...time after time after time at the end of that game?
Made no sense to me as I was watching the game...makes less sense to me now...

I agree

[houstontxbrave]

If I remember right, there was only 3.2 on the clock and some of that time was run down out front on the inbound play and the pass to Miller. I think the play was for Miller to take it all the way to the hoop but he threw the finger roll either because he thought time was running out or maybe he seen Rondo and anticipated a foul. There was no time left on the clock after the foul. With the game on the line, Miller dazed/hurt, the right thing maybe would of been to have someone else shoot even if it meant the lost of Miller if the game continued. He's a Boilermaker, tough and should of made them Maybe he has a career after BB is in the WWF, at lease he has the size and looks for it

I am sure he lost track of time but come on should it take an NBA player more then 3 seconds to from the top of the key to the basket?

He is a 10+ year veteran, it is no excuse to lose time on the clock. He should know that he has to go hard to the rim and if he is fouled fine, but to flip up a finger roll from 3 feet is not a quality move by a veteran NBA player. I will bet that even if he was not fouled he has about a 50/50 chance of making a finger roll from where he shot it from. Now if he were the Ice Man thats a completely different story.

[dogsrus]

If we REALLY want to point out why the Bulls should not have lost. How about up 10 under 3 to go. OUCH.

All in all though I like what I am seeing from these guys MUCH more then I did early in the year and for the last couple years.

Granted the Celts are without a key player but to even be having this conversation is a step in the right direction for the team.

[Out of Balance]

I am sure he lost track of time but come on should it take an NBA player more then 3 seconds to from the top of the key to the basket?

He is a 10+ year veteran, it is no excuse to lose time on the clock. He should know that he has to go hard to the rim and if he is fouled fine, but to flip up a finger roll from 3 feet is not a quality move by a veteran NBA player. I will bet that even if he was not fouled he has about a 50/50 chance of making a finger roll from where he shot it from. Now if he were the Ice Man thats a completely different story.

I never said he was the fastest or the the the smartest but he was above the FT line when he got the ball and there was some time off the clock. I think you have to agree. So lets say he got it with 2 sec.s (keeping in mind, there was only 3.2 on the inbounds. Considering his size, speed and jump, would you disagree if I say two steps (1 step per sec) that puts him where he finger rolled it and got fouled with no time remaining. I don't think he had much of a choice. If you don't agree how about we agree that he was heading in the right direction anyway JK Their not out of it yet

[Out of Balance]

If we REALLY want to point out why the Bulls should not have lost. How about up 10 under 3 to go. OUCH.All in all though I like what I am seeing from these guys MUCH more then I did early in the year and for the last couple years.

Granted the Celts are without a key player but to even be having this conversation is a step in the right direction for the team.

I agree dog

[houstontxbrave]

I never said he was the fastest or the the the smartest but he was above the FT line when he got the ball and there was some time off the clock. I think you have to agree. So lets say he got it with 2 sec.s (keeping in mind, there was only 3.2 on the inbounds. Considering his size, speed and jump, would you disagree if I say two steps (1 step per sec) that puts him where he finger rolled it and got fouled with no time remaining. I don't think he had much of a choice. If you don't agree how about we agree that he was heading in the right direction anyway JK Their not out of it yet

OoB, Id buy that if there was not 2 seconds remaining on the clock when Boston was inbounding the ball after Miller's misses. So, by NBA standards of clock functions it only took Miller 1.2 seconds to go from the top of the key to the finger roll.

Bottomline is its a lose, a very difficult lose, but they are not by any means out of this series. Even with all the fouls, missed FT's the Bulls did not stop Pierce or get the ball out of his hands and that essentially cost Chicago game 5.

[Out of Balance]

OoB, Id buy that if there was not 2 seconds remaining on the clock when Boston was inbounding the ball after Miller's misses. So, by NBA standards of clock functions it only took Miller 1.2 seconds to go from the top of the key to the finger roll.

Bottomline is its a lose, a very difficult lose, but they are not by any means out of this series. Even with all the fouls, missed FT's the Bulls did not stop Pierce or get the ball out of his hands and that essentially cost Chicago game 5.

If there was still 2 sec's on the clock, then we have no bit*h as the time keeper gave 5

I agree with you on the Pierce issue, just can't figure out that one

You know after thinking about it more there is only two people who could get to the hoop in the time BM had to, MJ and me Take care friend

[heybballfans]

so Howard suspended one game and rondo nothing. rondo didnt even get any flagrant foul points that acrue over a series and can lead to a suspension. Rondo got nothing for a dirtier foul than howard by ten times! so unfair

""Though Rondo made contact with Miller above the shoulders, NBA executive vice president of basketball operations Stu Jackson said the play fell short of warranting a flagrant foul.

"We felt Rondo was making a basketball play and going for the ball after a blown defensive assignment by the Celtic team," Jackson said.

"In terms of the criteria that we use to evaluate a flagrant foul penalty one, generally we like to consider whether or not there was a windup, an appropriate level of impact and a follow-through. And with this foul, we didn't see a windup, nor did he follow through. So for that reason we're not going to upgrade this foul to a flagrant foul penalty one.""""

this is not fair. referees said there was no wind up or follow through and just tried to make up for blown coverage by celtics defense.

Are you serious?!?! that is why it wasnt flagrant! geez so lame excuse. first of all there was a wind up and follow through. im so mad. refs should never be afraid to correct calls. geez. stop trying to be proud men and admit you made a mistake and correct it. im so mad i dont know what to do. it was clearly a foul above the shoulders at the head with no intent on ball. That is a clear definition of a flagrant foul. What else could rondo have done to get a flagrant!?!?!?

Bulls in 7. like rasheed wallace said, "the ball dont lie". and after that the ball wont serve any mor unjust happenings to the Bulls. So the ball will play out like it should have and Bulls win in 7.