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Old 12-14-2011, 01:30 PM
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Default OT - is anyone here a "protester"?

If so - Time Magazine has honored you as Person of the Year
http://blogs.voanews.com/breaking-ne...n-of-the-year/

My Person of the Year in college basketball is...
"the mid-major basketball player"....
(given two mid-major teams in the Final Four and the solid start this year for a couple mid-major conferences, including the MVC)
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Old 12-14-2011, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tornado View Post
If so - Time Magazine has honored you as Person of the Year
http://blogs.voanews.com/breaking-ne...n-of-the-year/

My Person of the Year in college basketball is...
"the mid-major basketball player"....
(given two mid-major teams in the Final Four and the solid start this year for a couple mid-major conferences, including the MVC)
that seriously has to be the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. The whole world is going mad........I'd like to see those person of the year covers side by side......I'm sure those that were chosen before just realized how meaningless it is now
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Old 12-15-2011, 01:16 AM
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Hitler got it in like 1938 or 39
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Old 12-15-2011, 02:09 AM
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Hitler '38
Stalin '39
Kruschev in '57
Khomeini in '79
The "Endangered Earth" in '88
Putin in '07
Obama in '08 (I'll give it to him, anyone that wins the Presidency tends to win POTY)
Bernake in '09
....
Not the first time I've disagreed with Time's choice of "Person of the Year"... though I still enjoy the magazine.
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Old 12-15-2011, 06:59 AM
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It's a litte outside the box, but It is very appropriate and I like the selection.

Now on to occupy Bradleyfans.com.
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Old 12-15-2011, 11:50 PM
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I can see a handful of people winning it without question, But i'd say the selection is a pretty solid one. Agree, a bit out of the box, but solid pick none the less.
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Old 12-16-2011, 09:02 AM
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just my two cents --
"protesters" do NOT give us or anyone - any better system or any better anything...so we'd better be careful when celebrating "protesters" without first checking what those protesters ushered in...
history shows that a LARGE percentage of protests gain us nothing and some result in substantially worse outcome than the protesters had to begin with!!!

All some protests do is help tear down the old system - then the door is open for the next system to come along....the "protesters" are often just rolling the dice hoping for something better but guaranteeing NOTHING.


I can easily think of lots of "protesters" who didn't like what they had so they staged PROTESTS...and lo & behold..
they ended up with something worse...

-"Red October" (no, not the movie) - Russians didn't like the Czars...
so they protested and ended up with Lenin, Stalin, 70 years of Communism, and more than 25,000,000 people murdered over the next few decades..and soemthing that had they ever envisioned they'd have never overthrown the Czars.

-the US had lots of protests in the 1960's and there's a lot of people who think all of it was good and reminisce about hippies, Woodstock, and Kent State...but ....what did we end up with...
laxed morals, God-less society and schools, an entire generation of self-absorbed nacissistic, lazy people expecting the government to supply their needs, incredible socialist spending that has now bankrupted the nation, we pulled out of Vietnam & chose to lose the war yielding the entire Asian peninsula to the Commies, and a million people were slaughtered, and now there are plenty who would love to go back to the peace & social systems of the pre-protest 50's & 60's - in other words we admire the protests but they resulted in a lot of bad stuff

-over the years various "protests" in China have simply led to more killings, political imprisonments & disappearances, and government crackdowns..not much has ever been gained

-current Arab protests have not yet resulted in any NEW stable, free, democratic governments - and as it apparent in Egypt - perhaps an even more oppressive Sharia law government could result

-then we come to the "Occupy" protesters who are all into themselves thinking they are the next great movement in the world..but all they're doing is tilting American more towards the SOCIALISM of those failing nations in Europe who have already tried all the very same things the "Occupy" people claim they want!
It is doomed to make American a WORSE nation for the vast majority of people.


To honor the protesters but NOT look at what their protests result in - is like honoring an eraser but ignoring what then gets written on the empty chalkboard
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Old 12-16-2011, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tornado View Post
just my two cents --
"protesters" do NOT give us or anyone - any better system or any better anything...so we'd better be careful when celebrating "protesters" without first checking what those protesters ushered in...
history shows that a LARGE percentage of protests gain us nothing and some result in substantially worse outcome than the protesters had to begin with!!!

All some protests do is help tear down the old system - then the door is open for the next system to come along....the "protesters" are often just rolling the dice hoping for something better but guaranteeing NOTHING.


I can easily think of lots of "protesters" who didn't like what they had so they staged PROTESTS...and lo & behold..
they ended up with something worse...

-"Red October" (no, not the movie) - Russians didn't like the Czars...
so they protested and ended up with Lenin, Stalin, 70 years of Communism, and more than 25,000,000 people murdered over the next few decades..and soemthing that had they ever envisioned they'd have never overthrown the Czars.

-the US had lots of protests in the 1960's and there's a lot of people who think all of it was good and reminisce about hippies, Woodstock, and Kent State...but ....what did we end up with...
laxed morals, God-less society and schools, an entire generation of self-absorbed nacissistic, lazy people expecting the government to supply their needs, incredible socialist spending that has now bankrupted the nation, we pulled out of Vietnam & chose to lose the war yielding the entire Asian peninsula to the Commies, and a million people were slaughtered, and now there are plenty who would love to go back to the peace & social systems of the pre-protest 50's & 60's - in other words we admire the protests but they resulted in a lot of bad stuff

-over the years various "protests" in China have simply led to more killings, political imprisonments & disappearances, and government crackdowns..not much has ever been gained

-current Arab protests have not yet resulted in any NEW stable, free, democratic governments - and as it apparent in Egypt - perhaps an even more oppressive Sharia law government could result

-then we come to the "Occupy" protesters who are all into themselves thinking they are the next great movement in the world..but all they're doing is tilting American more towards the SOCIALISM of those failing nations in Europe who have already tried all the very same things the "Occupy" people claim they want!
It is doomed to make American a WORSE nation for the vast majority of people.


To honor the protesters but NOT look at what their protests result in - is like honoring an eraser but ignoring what then gets written on the empty chalkboard
So I guess the people in Berlin were wasting their time back in 1989?

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Its awful hard, said Illini freshman guard D.J. Richardson, the former Central High School guard who played prep school ball a few miles from here and fought back tears outside the locker room. Its a hometown thing. Its bragging rights.
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Old 12-16-2011, 11:18 AM
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I hope people realize that they protesters the article and cover emphasise the most are not the Occupy people but the people across the world causing the Arab Spring. Those people stare death in the face and have taken down long time government bodies that did not care about its' people at all. Those people definitely deserve it'
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Old 12-16-2011, 11:33 AM
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http://www.time.com/time/specials/pa...2373-5,00.html

It's not until page 5 of the 8 paged story that Occupy is even mentioned.

And it's not like the Arab Spring is over. Yes, no real government has taken over yet, but these things take awhile. It took America 6 years after the Revolutionary War to form the governing body that exists today. During those six years, each state acted like its' own little country. So I wouldn't go judging those countries just because nothing has happened. We had our own heavily flawed system for six full years.
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Old 12-16-2011, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sousaman2089 View Post
I hope people realize that they protesters the article and cover emphasise the most are not the Occupy people but the people across the world causing the Arab Spring. Those people stare death in the face and have taken down long time government bodies that did not care about its' people at all. Those people definitely deserve it'

very much a +1

(just read the article)
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Bradley 72 - Illini 68 Final

Its awful hard, said Illini freshman guard D.J. Richardson, the former Central High School guard who played prep school ball a few miles from here and fought back tears outside the locker room. Its a hometown thing. Its bragging rights.
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Old 12-16-2011, 12:20 PM
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It should also be remembered that it is not necessarily about honoring someone/something - it is about influence. Protesters changed governments this year. Tornado is right that no one can be sure if good things will come from the changes due to protesters this year - but it is hard to argue that many people or groups were more influential than protesters this year.

Person of the year can be good or bad - that laundry list of terrible human have been the person of the year. in 1999 I remember Time planning to make Hitler the man of the century, but decided against it because of the obvious negative association, despite Hitler being one of the most important people of the 20th century.
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Old 12-16-2011, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChewaBrave View Post
Tornado is right that no one can be sure if good things will come from the changes due to protesters this year - but it is hard to argue that many people or groups were more influential than protesters this year.
+1

I'm glad TIME looked around the world for this year's person.
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Old 12-16-2011, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChewaBrave View Post
It should also be remembered that it is not necessarily about honoring someone/something - it is about influence. Protesters changed governments this year. Tornado is right that no one can be sure if good things will come from the changes due to protesters this year - but it is hard to argue that many people or groups were more influential than protesters this year.

Person of the year can be good or bad - that laundry list of terrible human have been the person of the year. in 1999 I remember Time planning to make Hitler the man of the century, but decided against it because of the obvious negative association, despite Hitler being one of the most important people of the 20th century.
Well said!
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Bradley 72 - Illini 68 Final

Its awful hard, said Illini freshman guard D.J. Richardson, the former Central High School guard who played prep school ball a few miles from here and fought back tears outside the locker room. Its a hometown thing. Its bragging rights.
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Old 12-16-2011, 01:28 PM
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So I guess the people in Berlin were wasting their time back in 1989?
I might remind you that those were not protesters, Ben -- those people were celebrating the already FALLEN Communist regime and thus they were free to climb on that wall that they'd have been shot down for doing a few weeks earlier..

the story of what led to them being able to climb on and mock the Berlin wall is lengthy but has virtually NOTHING to do with "protesting"...and just about everything to do with the USA beating them with technology, military might, and a better economic system
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Old 12-16-2011, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
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I might remind you that those were not protesters, Ben -- those people were celebrating the already FALLEN Communist regime and thus they were free to climb on that wall that they'd have been shot down for doing a few weeks earlier..

the story of what led to them being able to climb on and mock the Berlin wall is lengthy but has virtually NOTHING to do with "protesting"...and just about everything to do with the USA beating them with technology, military might, and a better economic system
So are you saying that the civil unrest in the GDR in 1989 had nothing to do with the GDR government relaxing the standards which led to the demise of the Berlin Wall??????? What were the East Germans supposed to do at that time? Wait around and see if they could travel to the West? The protests certainly played a part in pressuring the GDR government.....
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Its awful hard, said Illini freshman guard D.J. Richardson, the former Central High School guard who played prep school ball a few miles from here and fought back tears outside the locker room. Its a hometown thing. Its bragging rights.
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Old 12-16-2011, 03:18 PM
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I am sure some people will claim so but the true history of what happened shows otherwise...
people had protested the Berlin Wall for 28 straight years - so I hardly doubt a few protests in early 1989 were having much of any different effect than all those other protests...

BUT -- numerous eastern bloc governments (other than Germany) were collapsing economically, politically, and socially...Poland had FREE labor unions...and people were chomping at the bits for more freedoms...
...and then starting with Hungary early in 1989 the govt. officials made the fateful decision to open borders and allow people to pass - overriding concerns from Russia & elsewhere.
- the government began to just let people cross freely setting into action a sequence of the same things happening elsewhere, then finally in Berlin...

If you are going to credit the "protests" in Berlin which occurred later, then how did they have the effect we saw in Hungary & Czech?

If people want to believe the protests felled the Berlin Wall - then I won't try to dissuade them - it's nice story - BUT it was gonna fall anyway and was already halfway fallen when the protests accelerated - just read the numerous histories available.

But even if going back over 20 years allows you to find an example of protests paying off, then it still supports my point, that current ARAB & Occupy protests haven't achieved anything of lasting value yet - and in time we may see that they may possibly yield undesired future effects, as was experienced by the progeny of those 1917 Russian protesters.
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Old 12-16-2011, 03:31 PM
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BTW -- keep in mind that these people are protesters, too-- so I guess Time Mag thinks they're doing a great job for the world as well...

-Some Arab protesters killed, burned, and even raped innocent people
http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2011...7--300x300.jpg

-some Occupy protesters attacked and raped innocent women
http://thefeministwire.com/wp-conten...1/11/image.jpg

-some protesters simply don't like a given judge's or jury's decision so they go wild and set things on fire
http://www.prisonplanet.com/images/j.../280610top.jpg

-how about those who protest at cemeteries with such a hateful message?
http://brotherpeacemaker.files.wordp.../westboro1.jpg

-then believe it or not - there are a whole lot of protesters who are of this type and I guess they win this Man of the Year award, too...
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAkkk2.jpg

-then I saw a bit the other nite on a few protesters in Europe where a bunch of women stripped down and went topless to make their point -- so I guess in some weird fashion, those women also are Time's MAN of the YEAR, right??
(I won't give a link because it'll get deleted)

I am not alone in thinking that "The Protester" is a really ignorant choice and poorly thought out
given that they apparently include all the silly variants of protesters that I have cited..
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Old 12-16-2011, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tornado View Post
BTW -- keep in mind that these people are protesters, too-- so I guess Time Mag thinks they're doing a great job for the world as well...

-Some Arab protesters killed, burned, and even raped innocent people
http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2011...7--300x300.jpg

-some Occupy protesters attacked and raped innocent women
http://thefeministwire.com/wp-conten...1/11/image.jpg

-some protesters simply don't like a given judge's or jury's decision so they go wild and set things on fire
http://www.prisonplanet.com/images/j.../280610top.jpg

-how about those who protest at cemeteries with such a hateful message?
http://brotherpeacemaker.files.wordp.../westboro1.jpg

-then believe it or not - there are a whole lot of protesters who are of this type and I guess they win this Man of the Year award, too...
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAkkk2.jpg

-then I saw a bit the other nite on a few protesters in Europe where a bunch of women stripped down and went topless to make their point -- so I guess in some weird fashion, those women also are Time's MAN of the YEAR, right??
(I won't give a link because it'll get deleted)

I am not alone in thinking that "The Protester" is a really ignorant choice and poorly thought out
given that they apparently include all the silly variants of protesters that I have cited..

Just count to 10 and everything will be alight.
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Old 12-16-2011, 04:16 PM
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I gotta go out and protest something so I feel honored by Time & Ted Turner..
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